LR3 won't start, multiple codes and no solution. Trans fault Parking break fault, HDC
 

I recently bought a used 2005 LR3 v8 SE 4.4 with 99,500 miles. When I first picked it up, the car started and ran well. Then I started having starting issues, where rig would start, would run fine, then not start after it was turned off with multiple warnings on my dash including the giant F off to the side. When I left the car overnight it would again start in the morning and run fine, then not start after it was driven for a while. Obviously, something electrical was wrong - something LR3's I know they are know for. I have read about similar LR3 problems but so far those solutions have not worked. So far I have done the following, but the problem persists:

1 ) Sun Roof Drain Issues - When first I picked up the car I notice there was water in the passenger side floor which I cleaned up. When it began having starting issues, I did some research I found was the water caused by a faulty sunroof drain line, which I fixed (drains properly now). Checked out the wiring underneath the wet carpet - did seem to be any corroded wires or connections.
2) Transfer Case Control Module Replaced - I also found out the water intrusion can cause problems with the Transfer Case Control Module (TCM). Thinking that this may be the cause of the starting/multiple warning light issues, I replaced the TCM with a new one and cleaned up the electrical connectors. The hot non-start/warning light issues continued.
3) Air to Coil Spring Suspension Converted - During this time the were issues with the Air-Suspension, which I though may be contributing the to the electrical issues. So I purchased and replaced the Air Suspension with the Coil Spring Replacement Kit from Atlantic British. The new Coil Spring System worked fine and there was no more ride lowering/raising issues, but the car starting issues continued.
4) Brake Light Switch Replaced - Found out the Brake Light Switch can cause problems - Replaced and brake light work fine.
5) Starter Replaced - Then I was told the problem was likely the starter, so I replaced the starter (a pain in the ass to do). The car started fine after installation, no warning lights.But, again the same hot-no start issues.
4) Checked the alternator - charging @ 14.5 volts does not seem to be the problem
5) Replaced battery - was battery (dated 11/2023) and seemed to be good - 12.5 volts. But replaced it with a better battery anyway.

Now that I replaced the battery the car will not start even when cold, I still hear clicking behind the dash when I turn the key, but engine does not crank.
And the followingWarning Lights continue to appear:
-BRAKE: Amber Color
-PARK BRAKE: Amber Color
-PARK BREAK: Red (actually working, stays on unless I disengage)
-DSC: AMBER (clicking the button has no effect) and continually stays on

MESSAGE CENTER:
-PARK BREAK FAULT
-HDC FAULT SYSTEM NOT AVAILABLE
-ENGINE SYSTEM FAULT
-TRANSMISSION FAULT (Not all gears available or something)
and more about the parking brake.

Other Solutions I've tried.
-Checking taillights: all illuminate and are very bright
-Checked fuses: I checked the fuses related to the starter, ECM and TCM under the hood and inside the passenger compartment and none found were bad.
-Disconnected the battery, connected the two ends for 15 min to try a hard reset and then put it all back together. (turned on with all lights still illuminated)
-Checked for loose or disconnected wires - none found.
- Connected Code Reader and erase codes - still getting "Loss Communication with ECM/PCM-A" code.

It looks like some sort of ECM or PCM or BCM issue?a - but that is just a guess. Would appreciate any input or clue as what the culprit could be?
Thanks!

I suggest buying a GAP tool and reading the codes.

+1 on the GAP tool. The ~$400 price comes as a shock, but it's worth every penny.

You've probably replaced parts that weren't required and ruined the vehicles excellent ride with the coil conversion which didn't even fix the issue, was the TCCM programmed to the vehicle as they aren't plug n play.
Apart from having the codes read you need to check all the earth points and any electrical connector,

Thanks for the response.
New TCCM was not programed to the vehicle, but did start after it was installed. Have checked the earth (ground points)
I suppose I have to take it to Land Rover Dealer to have it programmed. Problem with that is the closest dealer is 260 miles away.

Reach out to GAP IID customer support (https://www.gap-diagnostic.com/support/contact/) and see if the GAP tool can program the TCCM. They may be able to send you the necessary firmware via download to the GAP tool (so you'll need to buy one) directly, and you only need a smartphone to use the GAP tool. It gives incredible access to various LR3 systems. For example, I used it to reflash the firmware on a rear differential electronic control module.

OK - Will check the GAP out.
I appreciate the help. Will let you know how it goes.

They certainly can, you purchase a fastlane flash and they include it in a firmware update.

Thanks for the info -
Just purchased the GAP IID Tool BT (G3) and the Fast Lane Service. Hope it leads to a fix.
All I am getting from my current code reader is Code U0100 -Lost Communications with engine control module/power train control/module A.
Is there a reason that would cause this message?
Or could it be caused by the new TCCM not being programmed?
I am a novice with this stuff, but don't mind learning.

Lost comm is nothing

U codes you can generally dismiss unless they are persistent which likely means you have a hard fault.

OK - Thanks for letting me know.

Purchased the GAP IID Tool and the Fast Lane Service need to flash the new TCCM. Found a one ECM Fuse 6 was blown and Fuse 13E was missing. Once the fuses were replaced it started up fine with no warning lights,messages, ect.

Was told by the guy a GAP Team that the new TCCM -Transfer case could be re-calibrated using GAP IIC Tool (rather than Reflashing the TCCM module) since the new module already had the correct firmware.

So after replacing a starter, battery and other parts, it appears the starting problem was pretty simple - which was what I thought would happen. Thanks for the advice to get the Gap Tool, it saved me, and probably will save me, alot of headaches. Been quite a learning experience. Thanks for everyone's help.

Sometimes replacing the TCCM works without interference and others it doesn't, glad you got it sorted and now you can enjoy how good these vehicles can be.

Thanks ! Appreciate your input - helped me get to the solution. Already started to like the LR3 - now that I got things sorted.

My problems with intermittent starting issues have resumed (see below). After sitting for a time the car will starts and runs fine. I then drive it around, park, then no start and transmission & engine faults show up on the display again when I turn the key. After it sits for awhile it starts again. I have the I checked and rechecked fuses, disconnected and made sure all grounds are good and checked the CAN connections and wires. I have purchased a GAP tool and been corresponding with those folks.

There still seems to be a connection issue after the car is runs for a time. Wondering if anyone has had the same problem and/or knows what is going on - seems to be a heat related issue.

Thanks

Have you scanned the truck for codes with the GAP tool? I would scan for codes when it's running fine and then again when it has the issue.

Yes I have scanned the truck with the GAP tool multiple times - running and not running, but have not intentionally done the comparison that you outlined. The truck will not start right now, but will do the comparison when it decides to start again. I have also been in touch with the GAP technician and have forwarded a fault list that he has looked at but he asked that I email a fault list with the engine running.

I really don't understand why the truck will start and drive fine, then not start after turn it off, then start again after it sits for awhile - makes no sense to me.

Thanks for you input.

When it doesn't start will it crank over or nothing ?

Nothing - I just hear a clicking noise when I turn the key in the passenger side where all the electrical wires, electrical grounds (that have recently been taken off and cleaned) and interior fuse box is located.
Add - I have replaced the Starter, TCCM Module, Battery, Brake Pedal Switch. When it randomly decides to start, it starts easily and runs great - then goes back to no start after I park it.

Any codes for the crank or cam sensors ? those get hot and fail then once cool work again or vice versa.

Thanks for the input - but no fault codes for the cam or crank sensors.

Today the LR3 started today after sitting for a couple days.The F warning light came on but was able to drive the car around, I parked did not turn off the engine and reviewed the Fault List on the GAP Tool. Lots of "loss communication" faults.but no crank or cam sensor faults.
I cleared the faults (see the faults that remained listed below) and drove the car around again, immediately after driving I the car, I shut it off and then restarted it - no problem - I did this several times no problem restarting. Then switched it off and let it sit for 5 minutes - no start again.

Body Control
B1A93-93 - Invalid roof position - Component failure - no operation (2B)
( on 08-05-2024 18:56:51 at 99475 mi )
B1C26-3A - Pedal motor feedback circuit - Frequency modulation/pulse width modulation failure - incorrect, has too many pulses (2B)
( on 08-05-2024 18:56:52 at 99475 mi )
B1C32-13 - Steering column tilt solenoid - General electrical failure - circuit open (2B)
( on 08-05-2024 18:56:52 at 99475 mi )
B1C34-13 - Steering column telescope solenoid - General electrical failure - circuit open (2B)
( on 08-05-2024 18:56:52 at 99475 mi )

Transfer Case
U1A35-4A - VIN data - System internal failure - incorrect component installed (2B)
( on 08-05-2024 18:56:57 at 99480 mi )

I understand the Transfer Case failure is probably caused by the new TCCM I installed, it probably needs to be programmed by the Land Rover dealer - but it does seem to work when it is running.
I do not understand the Steering Column Solenoid issue. Could this be the cause of the starting problem?
I really don't get what is going on. - Thanks for any input here.

Did you happen to record the codes before the clear? Being this is an intermittent issue having a data pull during the issue happening is probably going to yield the best information.

Yes - See attached fault list taken after it was driven and was running.
I also sent this fault list to the GAP Tech and he provided the following response:
"Its either a High speed CAN wiring issue or a bad IPC Instrument pack ECU. Both have been seen in the past. CAN wires run thru the car thus it can be anywhere.
Wiring attached,"
I then asked him; "Since the CAN wires issue can be "anywhere" would a bad IPC instrument pack ECU be the place to start? Is this something that needs to be programmed by a Land Rover Dealer? - I have not received a response yet.
I am wondering where the IPC Instrument Pack ECU is located? and if it is hard to to replace?

Thanks for your input.

The IPC Instrument Pack ECU is the instrument cluster with the gauges. I do see a bunch of codes for lack of communication with the PCM (engine control module). I agree with their assessment there could be an issue with the CAN bus. I'm curious if when the truck is acting up if you have communication with the PCM. I would also look for what modules you do not have communication with when the vehicle is acting up. Having that info might be able to help narrow down where the issue with the CAN bus is.

Also when the truck acts up take a multimeter and measure the voltage on pin 6 of the OBD connector and also in pin 14 of the OBD connector.

Thanks for the input. I will check out the items you noted in the next couple days.
When you say "acting up" do you mean not starting?
As a novice there are somethings you suggested that are a bit over my head - which one is the OBD connector? And how do you identify the pin #'s?

Finally Would the issues that I am having be something a Land Rover Service Ctr be able to diagnose and fix fairly easily?
My understanding it that they could reprogram the new TCCM which is one of the faults that consistently comes up.

Thanks again.

If the shop is any good they should be able to diagnose but sadly many dont have a clue, i would start at the wiring connector behind the LH wheel that sits on the chassis.
Its a known issue for canbus errors and can give similar symptoms to a failing IPC, my fiends car had similar starting problems and even after sending his cluster away to be repaired it still persisted.
Took it to a well known indy and they diagnosed and fixed it along with a few other items to the tune of 4K.
IPC issues usually manifest themselves with the cluster going on and off randomly as well as doors locking/unlocking and hazard lights coming one.

Thanks for the info - Will start at with connectors at the LH wheel - Left Rear Wheel?

Thanks!

sorry yes left rear and i meant to add that my friends car had a broken wire on one of the canbus circuits and once fixed it was good again.

Thanks for the clarification - that will be the first thing I check out this weekend. Hopefully I will have the same luck as your friend.

Your help is very much appreciated!