i have aftermarket bfg k02’s and for the most part the car is well insulated and can barely hear them

but the car in no means is quiet. the wind noise from the front windshield and A pillar above 65 is downright unacceptable. i have never been in a car or suv that had that much noise. So much noise my very young kids asked about it. but since most of the noise is coming from the front and at passenger seating level it’s much louder

But what do you expect. the truck is literally a rectangle on wheels. that almost flat windshield isn’t aerodynamic and is going to cause friction

if you are sensitive to noise i suggest you test drive it on the freeway

your Supra wasn’t built to be quiet. it’s a sport car and you pay for certain noises. part of the emotions you get driving such a car. but wind noise is purely bad design

 

my Supra is a cheap little sports car. There is a lot of wind noise and road noise, and not the kind of good exhaust sounds you actually want to hear. It’s not bad design, it’s cheap materials like window glass seals and sound deadening (lack of).

But the Defender costs 2x the Supra and is designed to be a luxury over lander, so if it’s actually very loud cruising, then I wouldn’t consider it. Maybe get a Porsche or Lexus instead.

 

You must be very sensitive, I regularly drive 80mph for 100 mile stints and it's not bothersome at all to my ears or anyone in my family.

The truck is built very well, the doors all seal well and close with a nice thwwwwppppp (IYKYK). I previously drove a 2012 Audi A4 avant, and this truck is far superior in build quality.

 

I think JLR absolutely is likely to get some share skimmed from luxury midsize segment, but to me the logical cross-shop options are:

- Jeep Wrangler
- Jeep Grand Cherokee ('22 redesign)
- Ford Bronco
- Toyota 4Runner
- Toyota Land Cruiser (now discontinued)
- Lexus GX
- Lexus LX (maybe a stretch)
- Mercedes G-class (only for buyers with 0 cost sensitivity)
- LR Discovery (brand cross-shop)
- RR Sport (brand cross-shop, particularly '22-'23 redesign)
- Ram/Ford luxury pickups (for folks who don't use the bed much, e.g., suburban daily drivers, no judgment intended)

Hard for me to see anything in the Porsche, Audi, BMW stables as logical cross-shops.

To be clear, I think there will be a non-trivial number of higher trim P400s optioned with street tires driven by Porsche, Audi, BMW target buyers. I think that those buyers would like one of these other options better as a daily driver.

 

Jeep folks may be interested but IMO a fairly well equipped Defender is way out of most of their budgets. At least in my area anyway there are Jeeps parked in every other driveway, they buy them for winter driving conditions up here in NY, the off-road thing is more of a fantasy around here than anything real like someone living in Utah might have. We have enough to battle traction-wise on the road. Yea it's nice to have the capability to go off road but I suspect it's a once or twice per year maybe light trails thing camping in the Adirondacks (at best). Once we get into 60-70k MSRPs it's pushing things way out of the range of most middle class budgets. Other states YMMV, like areas with no sales tax or higher income regions, these kinds of MSRPs become a lot more viable then. Preowned is another story, in three years when some of these start coming off-lease for 45k I think they'll be on a whole lot of peoples radar (e.g. Jeep crowd).

 

I should have specified Rubicons.... there is overlap at that price point. It's not at all uncommon to see these optioned into the 60s.

 

Wrangler AT’s

 

No significant arguing with your list, if Towing and load carrying capability are not included as factors.

If one wants to tow a horse trailer, thereby needing 7500 Lbs or so, the list shrinks considerably. Wrangler, Bronco, 4Runner, LX drop off

If one wants to carry large load, the list shrinks further -- surprisingly the G wagon has a very small useful load, for instance.

 

Running Wrangler Rubicon’s and no roof rack at this time and the noise is not bad. This is a tough question as there are several variables to consider…. Sun/Moon Roof? Roof Rack? Lunch Box/Ladder? These will all impact the noise. I started out with the all weather tires (not all terrain) and it was a fairly quiet ride. Switched to the rubicons and the road noise increased a bit but still not bad, I turn my radio up one level more to drown it out. Personally, now this is my own humble opinion, I think that one should expect a rattle or two and some other noise when driving any car. I’ve owned everything from Lexus RX350’s to BMW X5’s and all between and every one of them has their own unique annoying sounds. The most annoying sound in my Defender comes from a slight rattle on the rear passenger side right next to the tiny windows on the roof (I can’t think of their name). Would I love my car to be silent? Sure. But I’d have also liked to stay young forever….

 

“If you are going to buy this thing with an extended warranty or you are going lease it, I’m sure you will be very happy.”

This statement pretty much sums it up.