Front Upper Control Arm Replacement
Thread Starter
|
Mudding
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 197
Likes: 55
From: Madison, WI
Front Upper Control Arm Replacement
Hi Everybody,
Needing some quick help please. Car is up on jacks with various pieces already taken apart...
I need to replace the front Upper Control Arms on both sides. I will also be installing new Brake Pads, inner and outer Tie-Rod ends, and Sway Bars.
Issue - I don't know how to reach the bolt head for the bolt that secures the 'front' of the Upper Control Arm. It is located behind the air-suspension / strut assembly.
Do I need to remove the Strut assembly to get to this bolt-head? I have watched the Atlantic British video - Seems tricky to get to the 3 nuts on top of the strut, and the air-line attachment is probable something I will break, knowing my luck...
On the disco3.uk site I did a search for advice, and someone said that it 's necessary to remove the wheel arch.
I also did a search here, but couldn't find any info specific to removing and re-installing these front Upper Control Arms.
Also, I believe I need to make sure the distance between middle of Hub Nut to bottom of plastic wheel arch piece should be 485mm, before I tighten the various nuts to Torque spec?
If I do need to remove the air Bag / Strut, will I need a special 'calibration' or 'system reset' tool, after I have re-fitted? Will I have issues because I am not using a new brass nipple / o-ring piece? Do I need to somehow release all air before I remove the Strut and airline?
Would really appreciate any advice please, and I apologize if the Upper Control Arm replacement has already been covered here...
Thanks, Simon.
Needing some quick help please. Car is up on jacks with various pieces already taken apart...
I need to replace the front Upper Control Arms on both sides. I will also be installing new Brake Pads, inner and outer Tie-Rod ends, and Sway Bars.
Issue - I don't know how to reach the bolt head for the bolt that secures the 'front' of the Upper Control Arm. It is located behind the air-suspension / strut assembly.
Do I need to remove the Strut assembly to get to this bolt-head? I have watched the Atlantic British video - Seems tricky to get to the 3 nuts on top of the strut, and the air-line attachment is probable something I will break, knowing my luck...
On the disco3.uk site I did a search for advice, and someone said that it 's necessary to remove the wheel arch.
I also did a search here, but couldn't find any info specific to removing and re-installing these front Upper Control Arms.
Also, I believe I need to make sure the distance between middle of Hub Nut to bottom of plastic wheel arch piece should be 485mm, before I tighten the various nuts to Torque spec?
If I do need to remove the air Bag / Strut, will I need a special 'calibration' or 'system reset' tool, after I have re-fitted? Will I have issues because I am not using a new brass nipple / o-ring piece? Do I need to somehow release all air before I remove the Strut and airline?
Would really appreciate any advice please, and I apologize if the Upper Control Arm replacement has already been covered here...
Thanks, Simon.
Recovery Vehicle
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 831
Likes: 146
From: Herndon, VA
Yes to this part. Control arm nuts should always be tightened while the suspension is at the proper ride height. This means putting a jack under the rotor and jacking the whole control arm assembly up. Front should be 466mm though. Rear is 485mm.
Thread Starter
|
Mudding
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 197
Likes: 55
From: Madison, WI
Thanks cmb6s,
1. Follow-up question - Is it 466mm to the BOTTOM of the black plastic wheel arch trim piece, or 466mm to the TOP? I'm thinking bottom, because it would be easier to measure? And should I measure the distance exactly vertical, or at a slight 'angle', i.e. to the edge of the wheel arch? (Because the wheel arch trim piece 'sticks' out further (wider) than the center of the axel (Hub) bolt. I'm thinking I should measure it at the slight 'angle'.
2. Update re Upper Control Arm removal - I have removed the wheel liner, and I still can't get to the 'rear' bolt (head of rear bolt). There seems to be some heat-sink panels in the way. I've studied the back side of the Strut mount, and even if I removed the Strut, it doesn't seem as if this would 'open up' any more space, to get to the head of the Bolt.
Therefore, still confused. But staying calm, and trying not to do anything silly or unnecessary.
Helpful advice would be awesome.
1. Follow-up question - Is it 466mm to the BOTTOM of the black plastic wheel arch trim piece, or 466mm to the TOP? I'm thinking bottom, because it would be easier to measure? And should I measure the distance exactly vertical, or at a slight 'angle', i.e. to the edge of the wheel arch? (Because the wheel arch trim piece 'sticks' out further (wider) than the center of the axel (Hub) bolt. I'm thinking I should measure it at the slight 'angle'.
2. Update re Upper Control Arm removal - I have removed the wheel liner, and I still can't get to the 'rear' bolt (head of rear bolt). There seems to be some heat-sink panels in the way. I've studied the back side of the Strut mount, and even if I removed the Strut, it doesn't seem as if this would 'open up' any more space, to get to the head of the Bolt.
Therefore, still confused. But staying calm, and trying not to do anything silly or unnecessary.
Helpful advice would be awesome.
Thread Starter
|
Mudding
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 197
Likes: 55
From: Madison, WI
OK Everybody,
I got the job done, so I'm reporting back with a summary; hopefully this will help others in future.
1. Driver Side (on U.S. models, i.e. 'left' side) is more difficult to do than Passenger side - Because there is much more space to work with the 'front' Bolt Head, behind the Air Strut housing, on the Passenger side. You still cannot see this Bolt on the Passenger side, but there is about twice the amount of room available, for you to get your hand back there, which makes it much easier to work with your tools, in order to break loose the bolt, remove it, and re-tighten new bolt.
2. On both sides, I 'loosened' the aluminium (silver looking) heat shield. Undo 2 nuts, and undo 1 bolt. The 1 bolt is at a 'right angle', and screws into a bracket. Good news - None of these 3 items requires more than one wrench - The bolts that the 2 nuts fit onto stay connected and tight, as does the housing that the bolt screws into. It may not be necessary for you to loosen the heat shield, and I did not try to remove it (seemed too difficult), but at least it allows a little more room because you can move it slightly out of the way. I also pushed the part of teh heat shield that is behind the air-strut 'back' a little bit, on both sides, to be able to get to the 'front' Bolt. Especially necessary on Driver side.
3. I removed the plastic wheel arch piece, from either side. Provides more space. I can't remember if this was 'necessary', I think it was. Can be tricky to pop out the various plastic fasteners - You will need a 'bodyshop' kit with the various 'v-grooved' tools to pop these out. I used my cellphone to take various picture showing where all of the fasteners are - There's also some phillips head metal screws, and they are not all the same length - including one screw at the front of the vehicle that goes in vertically from teh bottom, and one that also goes in vertically from the bottom at the other side of the wheel arch. It was not difficult to remove teh wheel arch, or put it back in place, after removing all plastic fasteners and metal screws.
4. I downloaded the official 'manual' and it said to remove the small rectangle metal plate that sits underneath the Radiator. I did not do this. Perhaps this is the way the Dealership gets to the (hidden) 'front' bolt, when they have it up on a lift, and perhaps they have a special tool to get to this bolt.
5. As soon as I got the wheel off, I gave all of the nuts, bolts and connections a good blast of penetrating fluid, and then did other stuff for half an hour. Came back and sprayed it all again.
6. I did not have any issues breaking or undoing each nut and bolt, once I figured out how to get my tools connected.
7. Disconnect the Sway Bar Link and disconnect the Ball Joint that connects the Upper Control Arm to the Knuckle before you try to undo the front and rear nuts/bolts - Also remember to unclip the various wires, including CAREFULLY sliding the Ride Height Sensor 'arm' off - I sprayed some lube to make this easier. Use 2 hands to slide this off, carefully. After you have everything disconnected, you can begin trying to move the Arm up and down. This will help you be able to get to the 'front' nut, and also the 'rear' nut and bolt. It will be very tight at first - Spray some lube, and it will hopefully start to loosen it. Undo the 'back' nut and bolt first. Then start trying to loosen and remove the 'front' nut/bolt.
8. After putting all back together, I had no error codes. I did not know if disconnecting the ride height sensor arm would create issues with air suspension - all good! I did leave a door open though, from beginning of repair. Not sure if this was necessary.
9. Be prepared for the Knuckle unit (which holds the Hub and brake assembly) to very quickly tilt / fall towards you, after the Upper Control Arm ball joint is removed. Make sure you have enough strong zip-ties within arms reach, so that you can put a zip-tie through the hole that the ball joint connects into, and find somewhere ' up above' to wrap around the zip-tie. Use 2 zip-ties, as a precaution if one fails. daisy chain them together if not long enough.
10. Buy new Nuts and Bolts! It seems that most suppliers of the Upper Control Arm do not include new nuts and bolts, but the Ball Joint does come with a new nut attached. I got my nuts and bolts from Atlantic British. There are no 'alignment' considertaions for the Upper Control Arm nuts and bolts - Simply tighten them to torque spec.
11. Before torque-spec tightening the Ball Joint, the Sway Bar Link and the front and rear nuts / bolts, use a jack to lift the knuckle / lower control arm, so that the distance from middle of Axel Nut to bottom of plastic wheel fender trim is 466mm. Which is about 18.3 inches. Note - I could not lift mine this high without lifting the entire vehicle off the Jack Stands, which I figured was putting too much pressure on the Front suspension and Air Bag, so I tightened everything at a distance of approximately 20 inches. I'm hoping the 1.5 inch difference won't do any harm.
12. The way I reached the (hidden) Upper Control Arm 'front' Bolt head, is to use an 18mm socket, attached to a 'wobbler', attached to a 6 inch extension bar, attached to a breaker bar. The other end of teh bolt, with the nut, is shaped hexagonally, so one you have broken the bolt free, you could, if you want to, attach a small wrench to the end of the bolt to stop it turning, as you undo the nut.
13. It is not possible to use a Socket to undo the Nut - You must use a Wrench, because one of the bolts that sticks through the back of the heat-shield is too close to the end of the nut. Marvelous design. This heat-shield bolt is about 3/4 of an inch long.
14. I swapped out a new Sway Bar Link on each side, since I needed to disconnect one end of it, and they are cheap. This would also be a good time to inspect and test the anti-roll bar 'bushings' for play. I forgot to do this...
15. I had planned to swap out both sides inner and outer tie rod ends, but discovered that the Driver side inner tie rod end that I was sent is probably wrong type - It's about half an inch longer than current inner, and also the ball joint end is smaller. Which suggests that it's not as good quality, even if the length was correct. I made sure that I kept the Outer and Inner screwed together in exactly the same place, to lessen any Alignment issues. Glad I did this... I did not detect and looseness or wobbling with the Inner / outer removed from vehicle - I was going to swap them out as 'preventative' maintenance. I put old inner/outer tie rod ends back on vehicle. I do need to get a new clip though, to secure the rubber boot. Looks as of I will need one that starts at about 3.3 inch diameter, so easily fit around boot, before tightening. I also put some more grease in the boot, for good measure.
Went for a test drive last night, all good. Nice and smooth.
Feel free to offer positive or negative feedback!
Cheers, Simon
I got the job done, so I'm reporting back with a summary; hopefully this will help others in future.
1. Driver Side (on U.S. models, i.e. 'left' side) is more difficult to do than Passenger side - Because there is much more space to work with the 'front' Bolt Head, behind the Air Strut housing, on the Passenger side. You still cannot see this Bolt on the Passenger side, but there is about twice the amount of room available, for you to get your hand back there, which makes it much easier to work with your tools, in order to break loose the bolt, remove it, and re-tighten new bolt.
2. On both sides, I 'loosened' the aluminium (silver looking) heat shield. Undo 2 nuts, and undo 1 bolt. The 1 bolt is at a 'right angle', and screws into a bracket. Good news - None of these 3 items requires more than one wrench - The bolts that the 2 nuts fit onto stay connected and tight, as does the housing that the bolt screws into. It may not be necessary for you to loosen the heat shield, and I did not try to remove it (seemed too difficult), but at least it allows a little more room because you can move it slightly out of the way. I also pushed the part of teh heat shield that is behind the air-strut 'back' a little bit, on both sides, to be able to get to the 'front' Bolt. Especially necessary on Driver side.
3. I removed the plastic wheel arch piece, from either side. Provides more space. I can't remember if this was 'necessary', I think it was. Can be tricky to pop out the various plastic fasteners - You will need a 'bodyshop' kit with the various 'v-grooved' tools to pop these out. I used my cellphone to take various picture showing where all of the fasteners are - There's also some phillips head metal screws, and they are not all the same length - including one screw at the front of the vehicle that goes in vertically from teh bottom, and one that also goes in vertically from the bottom at the other side of the wheel arch. It was not difficult to remove teh wheel arch, or put it back in place, after removing all plastic fasteners and metal screws.
4. I downloaded the official 'manual' and it said to remove the small rectangle metal plate that sits underneath the Radiator. I did not do this. Perhaps this is the way the Dealership gets to the (hidden) 'front' bolt, when they have it up on a lift, and perhaps they have a special tool to get to this bolt.
5. As soon as I got the wheel off, I gave all of the nuts, bolts and connections a good blast of penetrating fluid, and then did other stuff for half an hour. Came back and sprayed it all again.
6. I did not have any issues breaking or undoing each nut and bolt, once I figured out how to get my tools connected.
7. Disconnect the Sway Bar Link and disconnect the Ball Joint that connects the Upper Control Arm to the Knuckle before you try to undo the front and rear nuts/bolts - Also remember to unclip the various wires, including CAREFULLY sliding the Ride Height Sensor 'arm' off - I sprayed some lube to make this easier. Use 2 hands to slide this off, carefully. After you have everything disconnected, you can begin trying to move the Arm up and down. This will help you be able to get to the 'front' nut, and also the 'rear' nut and bolt. It will be very tight at first - Spray some lube, and it will hopefully start to loosen it. Undo the 'back' nut and bolt first. Then start trying to loosen and remove the 'front' nut/bolt.
8. After putting all back together, I had no error codes. I did not know if disconnecting the ride height sensor arm would create issues with air suspension - all good! I did leave a door open though, from beginning of repair. Not sure if this was necessary.
9. Be prepared for the Knuckle unit (which holds the Hub and brake assembly) to very quickly tilt / fall towards you, after the Upper Control Arm ball joint is removed. Make sure you have enough strong zip-ties within arms reach, so that you can put a zip-tie through the hole that the ball joint connects into, and find somewhere ' up above' to wrap around the zip-tie. Use 2 zip-ties, as a precaution if one fails. daisy chain them together if not long enough.
10. Buy new Nuts and Bolts! It seems that most suppliers of the Upper Control Arm do not include new nuts and bolts, but the Ball Joint does come with a new nut attached. I got my nuts and bolts from Atlantic British. There are no 'alignment' considertaions for the Upper Control Arm nuts and bolts - Simply tighten them to torque spec.
11. Before torque-spec tightening the Ball Joint, the Sway Bar Link and the front and rear nuts / bolts, use a jack to lift the knuckle / lower control arm, so that the distance from middle of Axel Nut to bottom of plastic wheel fender trim is 466mm. Which is about 18.3 inches. Note - I could not lift mine this high without lifting the entire vehicle off the Jack Stands, which I figured was putting too much pressure on the Front suspension and Air Bag, so I tightened everything at a distance of approximately 20 inches. I'm hoping the 1.5 inch difference won't do any harm.
12. The way I reached the (hidden) Upper Control Arm 'front' Bolt head, is to use an 18mm socket, attached to a 'wobbler', attached to a 6 inch extension bar, attached to a breaker bar. The other end of teh bolt, with the nut, is shaped hexagonally, so one you have broken the bolt free, you could, if you want to, attach a small wrench to the end of the bolt to stop it turning, as you undo the nut.
13. It is not possible to use a Socket to undo the Nut - You must use a Wrench, because one of the bolts that sticks through the back of the heat-shield is too close to the end of the nut. Marvelous design. This heat-shield bolt is about 3/4 of an inch long.
14. I swapped out a new Sway Bar Link on each side, since I needed to disconnect one end of it, and they are cheap. This would also be a good time to inspect and test the anti-roll bar 'bushings' for play. I forgot to do this...
15. I had planned to swap out both sides inner and outer tie rod ends, but discovered that the Driver side inner tie rod end that I was sent is probably wrong type - It's about half an inch longer than current inner, and also the ball joint end is smaller. Which suggests that it's not as good quality, even if the length was correct. I made sure that I kept the Outer and Inner screwed together in exactly the same place, to lessen any Alignment issues. Glad I did this... I did not detect and looseness or wobbling with the Inner / outer removed from vehicle - I was going to swap them out as 'preventative' maintenance. I put old inner/outer tie rod ends back on vehicle. I do need to get a new clip though, to secure the rubber boot. Looks as of I will need one that starts at about 3.3 inch diameter, so easily fit around boot, before tightening. I also put some more grease in the boot, for good measure.
Went for a test drive last night, all good. Nice and smooth.
Feel free to offer positive or negative feedback!
Cheers, Simon
Baja
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 5,736
Likes: 230
From: south n.j. and ne va.
Sorry I don't check all the topics , in the tech section I did a full poly bush suspension, the front upper bolts suck but I got them without removing liners or anything, I had the dealer align after
Mudding
Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 133
Likes: 25
From: North Carolina USA
Upper control arm 2005 LR3
anyone know the torx specs for the upper control arm bushing bolts and ball joint 😊
Camel Trophy
Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 4,964
Likes: 950
From: Green Bay, WI
https://workshop-manuals.com/landrov...pecifications/
Upper arm to frame support is 129 ft/lbs. Upper ball joint to knuckle is only 52 ft/lbs - and I say only because that is not much, but if you over torque by too much the ball joint stud can snap. I myself did it and so have some others.
Upper arm to frame support is 129 ft/lbs. Upper ball joint to knuckle is only 52 ft/lbs - and I say only because that is not much, but if you over torque by too much the ball joint stud can snap. I myself did it and so have some others.
Mudding
Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 133
Likes: 25
From: North Carolina USA
Torx upper control arm
https://workshop-manuals.com/landrov...pecifications/
Upper arm to frame support is 129 ft/lbs. Upper ball joint to knuckle is only 52 ft/lbs - and I say only because that is not much, but if you over torque by too much the ball joint stud can snap. I myself did it and so have some others.
Upper arm to frame support is 129 ft/lbs. Upper ball joint to knuckle is only 52 ft/lbs - and I say only because that is not much, but if you over torque by too much the ball joint stud can snap. I myself did it and so have some others.