After a couple of years of P2002 and massive research and many weeks at the shop and work with the factory, I now know way too much about diesel fuel and DPF. Have almost 70K and a lot of trailer towing and long trips and now a new DPF but after much haggling, the $8k cost was covered under warranty and goodwill. Things I’ve learned.

1. There are dealers with diesel knowledge and ones with little. If you can find one of the 3 remaining solely LR dealers in the US, go to them. The huge mixed Nashville dealer wasn’t even aware of the weekly factory engineering calls because “we don’t have any mechanics that are that senior with LR”, Appointments take weeks and then the car sits for weeks, and then you are told “your fuel smelled funny so we replaced it”. I now drive 500 miles to the knowledgeable Lake Bluff LR-only (not JLR) dealer in Illinois.

2. Use your other car for short trips, or make sure you do an extended freeway speed run without slowing down or stopping for 2 hours minimum every week or 2. That’s from online research. The mechanics who can do a forced regen say it takes them an hour before it will let them do it so for the built in one to work, it needs time, much more than other diesels from my experience.

3. “Premium” or “Efficient” diesel is a misleading marketing term that usually means biodiesel, which is to be avoided at all costs! The manual says the car can handle up to 5%, but as many pumps say, it can vary from 5-20. In the Midwest, you have to do some searching to find stations that sell pure diesel and not biodiesel, and it is a lot more expensive due to no tax incentives. Before I knew about LR problems with this (my previous VW TDI handled it fine), all the fuel injectors and some other fuel related stuff had to be replaced under warranty due to all the crud. I’ve found in non Midwest states this isn’t as much of a problem and pure diesel is much easier to find and cheaper. https://www.google.com/mymaps/viewer...L41fUjx0&hl=en This is for the Chicago area.

4. The factory asked if I wouldn’t mind being a beta tester to help them try and get to the bottom to the P2002 problem and asked me to record and send them details of my drives and pictures of every fuel stop and mileage at each. After different experiments, an additive they sent did cure the stumbling problem and delayed the recurrence frequency of P2002 but only a DPF replacement “fixed” it, and hopefully helps save the new DPF. The new DPF is really just a bandaid. They admit they don’t know the root cause of the premature P2002 DPF problems, but since the additive seems to help, they have stopped researching it since there are so few TD6 cars in the US. They have provided it for free to me for as long as I own the car but I doubt they are telling other dealers about that. I’ll post an image of the bottle, since I’ve never seen it in stores.

Still love the car and hope my painful P2002 experience is helpful to someone, or at least entertaining! Grin

2017 TD6 with factory accessory rooftop box (Love it), towing horse trailer and RV trailer frequently.


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Forgive my ignorance as I'm trying to decode all of what you're saying.

I have a 2017 Td6 and love it. Had some stumbling issues early but the dealer was able to fix (I believe via software). I have not had any issues since and now sit at @45k miles.

This is my daily driver (medium commute usually, none now in COVID). But roughly every six months or so I use it to drive 900-1k miles to the east coast and back. Based on what I can tell you're saying this is a good thing?

So, what is "regen" and "DPF"? Also, here in Dallas I haven't seen many options when it comes to diesel but I'll start paying attention now.

Thanks

As 2018 TD6 HSE Lux owner (pulling horses and boats) as well as the BG Distributor for the Carolina's and am a believer in the DFC product, EPR, DOC for the crankcase and use our BG 716 Diesel oil in mine all with great results. The key is to minimize ash going to the DPF to avoid "face plugging" and/or going into needless consistent regeneration modes. The combination of DOC/BG 716 Oil is a great acid fighter (among other things) in the crankcase with keeps it "healthy" and minimizes deposits. On the fuel side, anything you can do to improve the quality of the Diesel from deposit control perspective will help as well. BG products work...and they provide protection backing it up.

I didn't know BG had diesel additives but like most of their products, it looks like good stuff. If we had the same quality of diesel available in the US that they have in Europe, we wouldn't have half the problems we do with diesel here in the US. Subsidies to farmers are very political and that is the only reason biodiesel exists; put it in its own pump and nobody would pay for that crap. The only good thing about biodiesel is that it puts back some of the lubricity lost when ULSD became the mandate in 2007. As little as B5 will restore the diesel with enough lubricity to save your HPFP, but you don't want any more of it than that. The main problem with biodiesel are its hygroscopic properties that absorb water from the atmosphere. Water in your fuel, particularly in a diesel, is not good. If you are forced to run biodiesel on a regular basis, change your oil more frequently but given the propensity of these JLR SCR systems to dump fuel into your oil in an aborted active regen, you shouldn't be pushing more than 7,500 miles or so an OCI, anyways. If you are going to run straight diesel here in the US, make sure you are using a good diesel additive with a lubricity improver, or else you risk scarring your HPFP.

Renewable Diesel, however, is significantly different than biodiesel, and 10x better than either it or the regular diesel found in our pumps in the US. Biodiesel is almost subpar diesel, whereas Renewable Diesel (RD) really is a premium diesel. Unfortunately, RD is only available in large quantities at the moment in Southern California (of all places.) https://propelfuels.com/our_fuels Valero has a subsidiary called Diamond Green Diesel near Norco, Louisiana that produces RD and is currently planning to start construction in 2021 on the first dedicated RD plant in Texas near Port Arthur.

As for clogging the DPF, I guess I'm running an $86k science experiment on my dime for JLR, but I figure if I take care of the vehicle correctly from day 1, if it has worked for anybody else, then it's got to work for me. I'm still not certain if my driving style (trip duration) will be conducive to the lifespan of this particular DPF but I've owned multiple VW and BMW diesels prior to with DPF's, and JLR is the only one trying to tell you that you need an ACEA C1 oil. Previous literature that I have from JLR literally said that if you couldn't find a C1 oil that a C2 would be acceptable. Keep in mind, your DPF is covered under the 8 year, 80k mile warranty for emissions. Most folks including most dealers, however, can't tell you the difference between a C1 or a C2/C3 oil, and one JLR dealer that I spoke to in Louisiana sent me a pic of the oil they use on their diesels, and it was a Castrol C3 oil. Looked very similar to the one JLR calls for, but if you don't know what ACEA C1 or C2 means, it's easy to assume it was the same. Keep in mind, Mercedes, VW/Audi, BMW, and others all use C2/C3 oils with DPFs all the time.

1) Avoid more than B5 blends of biodiesel.
2) Add a quality diesel additive at every fill to add cetane, improve lubricity, and clean/protect your injectors.
3) Select a quality oil with a low Sulfated Ash content, (why I like ACEA C2/C3 oils better than FA-4 or CK-4)
4) Change your oil and diesel fuel filter no less than what the manual says.

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BG has a full line of diesel products. Most of the distributors have not focused not the diesel market as of yet. Here in the Carolina's we are doing a lot of work with diesel owners (passenger to Big Rig) in the DPF world. Educating what really is going on and what their vehicle really needs based upon the symptoms. Let me know if I can help.

Regarding the DPF being covered under the 80k emissions warranty, I tried that. Two dealers have said it is a filter, like the oil and air filter, and not covered. If you can find something that clears that up, that would be awesome. I had to go through quite a fight and a number of P2002 trips to the dealer to get it replaced at about 55k I think it was, even though the P2002 messages started at 25-30k.

I do think it has something to do with towing. On my 1k mike towing trips, I would go through a gallon of DEF about every 500 miles, when mpg was in the 16-18 range.

And thanks for posting all that detail!

I've heard a handful of stories now where it's like the dealers aren't even talking to JLR Corporate whereas if the dealer actually went back and asked JLR they would be like, of course, we'll cover those repairs. Sometimes the repairs as you suggested are done out of goodwill but it's not the dealer's goodwill, it's the manufacturers. The dealer is just an independent contractor for the overall vehicle brand, the dealer doesn't pay for the warranty work, the manufacturer reimburses the dealers.

The real irony here is that for most of these dealers they don't really know much about diesels and thereby they really don't know what they are even talking about. I could see a case where a dealer may choose not to even employ any diesel technicians or the tools (even though the manufacturer says that if they want to put their brand on their doors, they have to) and so they are kicking back on the consumer hoping they will just go find another dealer. (Dispute resolution process is also detailed in the back of the owners manual, as well, FYI.)

The below is from the 2020 manual available online, which is pages 444 and 445 in my hard copy of the manual. The online manual for previous years doesn't speak to anything about the warranty but it's required by law so I'm sure you have it somewhere if perhaps even a separate addendum. The thing is, the 8 year, 80k mile warranty is not there because the manufacturer is being generous, it's there because it's required by Federal law. The reason you can't so easily just remove your DPF is because it's Federally required by law.

The SCR particulate filter is your DPF and yes, it is integral to the SCR catalyst.

EXHAUST SYSTEM (INCLUDING DIESEL SELECTIVE CATALYST REDUCTION (SCR) SYSTEM):

• Catalytic converter¹, ²
  
• EGR cooler and valve housing assembly
  
• Exhaust manifold
  
• Exhaust pipe (manifold to catalytic converter)
  
• SCR catalyst¹
  
• SCR heater control unit
  
• SCR injector
  
• SCR oxidation catalyst¹
  
• SCR particulate filter⁵
  
• SCR pump
  
• SCR tank
  
• SCR tank filler hose
  
• SCR tank interior module
  
  ⁵ Covered for eight (8) years or 80,000 miles (130,000 kilometres), whichever occurs first, where the SCR particulate filter is integral to the SCR catalyst and/or the SCR oxidation catalyst
• https://www.ownerinfo.landrover.com/.../proc/G2426883

The Selective Catalyst and the DPF are not the same. The DPF collects all of the soot and the NOx is passed through it to mix with the DEF and in the SCR it turns into Nitrogen and h2o.

Sure. I didn't intend to imply that, though. Per the terms used in the JLR emission warranty verbiage above, the SCR particulate filter is otherwise known as the Diesel Particulate Filter, or DPF. It's the same thing. Just lawyers being as$holes trying to confuse service managers and consumers.

2017 models warranty is as follows:

Certain emission-control parts, including the vehicle’s catalytic converter, engine control module and transmission control module, are covered for 8 years/80,000 miles.

FY!