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Confirming that narrower winter tires do work better

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Old Dec 4, 2024 | 05:50 PM
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Default Confirming that narrower winter tires do work better

I'm a long-term dedicated fan of Nokian winter tires and have been running Nokian Hakka R5 winter tires on our Defenders the last 2 winters. One set was worn down to the "2" symbol on the tread and needed replacing. The closest size Nokian that fits the Defender is 275 width, which is a little wide for optimal deep snow traction. Michelin now makes an X-Ice SUV winter tire in the OEM Defender size which is 255 width, so I bought 5 and put them on last weekend.

I had to travel to upstate NY on business yesterday and the Great Lakes snow machine is in full operation. These Michelin winter tires handled great, especially on the ride home when I hit a 2 hour snow squall and the snowplows I saw out all day dumping tons of road salt had vanished. Most people were content to crawl along in the right lane and stay in the 2 melted tire tracks. With 300 miles to home, I put the Defender in snow mode and cruised down the unplowed left lane. 50 mph felt completely safe and I never felt any slippage at all. Now I'm a huge fan of these 255 wide Michelin X-Ice tires.

Funny how the Defender dashboard is ever evolving and changing. When snow, ice, slush and road salt would build up on the front of our 2021, a big warning sign would pop-up front and center, "yelling" that the front collision system was not working. On the 2025, a tiny little yellow icon lights up that shows the rear end of a vehicle, an exclamation point and the front of another vehicle. This yellow icon is smaller than a dime and I barely noticed it.

Here is my biggest complaint...why can't JLR put a rubber seal along the front edge of the Defender hood. I'm one of those people that details the engine compartment when I change the oil. Today when I went to replace the nearly 2 gallons of windshield washer fluid I went through, I found the entire engine bay covered in road salt residue. The plastic engine cover was all white with road salt crud. If Mazda can seal the leading edge of my daughter's CX-5 hood, JLR can do it too. Her CX-5 engine compartment still looks like brand new after 2 years (and 2 winters).
 

Last edited by PaulLR; Dec 4, 2024 at 05:52 PM.
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Old Dec 4, 2024 | 08:01 PM
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yep, there's clearly design flaw with that hood.
 
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Old Dec 5, 2024 | 08:09 AM
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Once again, those weenie southerners posting things that we Maine-ahs have known forevah.

We call the tall skinny winter tires "Pizza Cutters" for obvious reasons. More pressure on the reduced tire contact patch gets you deeper down in the white stuff - usually down to the blacktop.

Note that this kind of tire is the exact opposite of what you want *offroad* in the snow where you really want to try and float on top of the white stuff.

 
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Old Dec 5, 2024 | 08:32 AM
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Originally Posted by TeddyG
yep, there's clearly design flaw with that hood.
+1 for the lack of a rubber seal around the front of the hood, They have one wrapped around the back of the hood, why can't they do the sides & front? I detailed my engine bay about five weeks ago and it looks like this. I haven't gone off-road, driven in dusty environments, and the roads aren't that salty. My Porsche and Audi are spotless under the hood. You'd think the proper 4x4 would be, too.


 
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Old Dec 5, 2024 | 08:48 AM
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Is there an airflow / heat management issue at play here perhaps? Otherwise, why couldn't someone just go to: https://www.mcmaster.com/products/seals/edge-seals-1~/ Find a appropriate high temp edge seal and slap it on the underside of the hood?

Seems like a rather straightforward problem to solve.
 
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Old Dec 5, 2024 | 09:04 AM
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Originally Posted by H1Tad
Is there an airflow / heat management issue at play here perhaps? Otherwise, why couldn't someone just go to: https://www.mcmaster.com/products/seals/edge-seals-1~/ Find a appropriate high temp edge seal and slap it on the underside of the hood?

Seems like a rather straightforward problem to solve.
On the L405 Range Rover, L494 Range Rover Sport and L462 Discovery, the air intake is actually integrated into the hood, but all of them have rubber sealing surrounding the entire hood. Defender's air intake is on the driver's side vent (V8 & OCTA use both sides) but still makes no sense why they decided against it. Maybe its heat management like you suggested. Maybe it was cost cutting. Who knows, but its annoying. I'm tired of detailing my engine bay on a semi-regular basis. Hell, the owner's manual tells you not to detail the engine bay due to the risk of damaging something.

I've attached a link that explains how the air intake works. It is pretty genius. You can also see the seal around the engine bay in the video.

https://jalopnik.com/the-2017-land-r...ant-1793607086
 
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Old Dec 5, 2024 | 09:09 AM
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Air intake and heat management are separate things obviously. Any air flowing between the hood and the grill isn't getting sucked into the combustion chamber

This gap in the hood - it could help supplement air flow under the hood to keep the engine bay cooler while at speed. It wouldn't be difficult for someone with a bluetooth BBQ thermometer to take a couple readings while driving around town and on the highway - then installing one of the aforementioned seals then doing the same thing.

EDIT: Well now that I watch that disco video I'm not so sure anymore. That is such a weird intake design.
 

Last edited by H1Tad; Dec 5, 2024 at 09:11 AM.
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Old Dec 5, 2024 | 10:19 AM
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Glad to hear that the new Michelin tires worked well for you (as well the Defender) in your recent travels.

I was faced with the same purchasing quandary, however decided to stick with the Nokians (long time fan/user of them). I haven’t had them in any major snow yet, however they are doing well so far. I would have preferred the narrower profile, but stuck with brand experience. Hopefully they will work out well for me.
 
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Old Dec 5, 2024 | 11:53 AM
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Originally Posted by Kaylorsan
Glad to hear that the new Michelin tires worked well for you (as well the Defender) in your recent travels. I was faced with the same purchasing quandary, however decided to stick with the Nokians (long time fan/user of them). I haven’t had them in any major snow yet, however they are doing well so far. I would have preferred the narrower profile, but stuck with brand experience. Hopefully they will work out well for me.
Still running Nokian Hakka R5's on our 2021 Defender. They did great last winter on weekly ski trips to VT in all sorts of weather conditions. Also running Hakka R5 winter tires on our CX-5 and Hakka R3's winter tires on our Honda Passport. I never would have even considered trying another winter tire brand if Nokian made a Defender OEM size winter tire.
 
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Old Dec 6, 2024 | 06:45 AM
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"....maybe it was cost cutting" is my strongly opinionated guess based on prior history!
 
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