Just got this response.

Tyler,

I appreciate your efforts and understand that you are trying to save money, but your information is not based on a quality engine rebuild and you are not considering all of the parts, materials, and supplies you will need. In the automotive program we don’t patch things together or cover up problems. If we do the job, we do it right; that is what we want to teach the students. Also, I know that the only way we can ever make you happy is to complete the project within the price that we quote you. If we go over budget, no one will be happy. The figures that you are quoting are not realistic and we could never do it for that price. I have also done quite a bit of homework on your engine, and I have a lot of experience rebuilding engines—this is what I do for a living. I can assure you that in the end, the price will be in the range that we were visiting about on the phone.

I hope this helps. Let me know if you have any other questions.

Professor ...

 

Heck, for the $5000 he was quoting you, you could probably import an engine from turner or rpi.

That piston is not even the best example:

Land Rover parts, spares, Land Rover accessories - Search results for 611659L
LAND ROVER PARTS - ROCKER SHAFT - V-8

Try that one.

So is this the former Ricks College that is doing this rebuild?

 

Yep, nailed it. I sent him the rocker shaft example, that's amazing. His response sounded pretty darn stubborn to me but I'm giving him one last shot before I say screw it. Here's my response:

"Professor...

I don't doubt your experience or credentials, I was hoping you'd tell me what parts you intend to use. There are tons of places to save money on this engine without cutting corners, such as the rocker shaft. Aftermarket is under $20 (Land Rover parts, spares, Land Rover accessories - Search results for 611659L), OEM is over $200 (LAND ROVER PARTS - ROCKER SHAFT - V-8). I'm not looking for a cheaply built engine, but I'm comfortable with the quality of the Allmakes brand with the exception of their lifters and cam which I would source elsewhere.

Like I stated, I'm very willing to do the research and get the parts cost down. I'm not looking for a band-aid, but it doesn't need to be treated like a luxury vehicle either. I'd really appreciate some help as far as understanding how you are coming up with a total of $3000 of parts."

 

His response isn't completely out of line. I would much rather a shop be honest about a worst probable case, and it looks like that is what they are teaching their students. You might be better off building it yourself, that way you can use the cheap parts where you want to, and the better parts where you feel you need to.

 

RPi Engineering - V8 Engines

D&D Fabrications: Engineering & Fabrication Services

 

Yeah that what seems likely. I'll just have to make this one limp along another year or two before I have time and money concurrently, but if they don't rebuild it I definitely will in the future.

 

I actually thought the Allmakes lifters were pretty good. It's the timing set and cam I'd look elsewhere for. Although, your cam can just be re-ground for around $100 so you don't really even need a new one.

I have 1200 miles on my all Allmakes (even the parts I don't recommend) rebuild and it runs perfectly so far. Not even a single leak too I know it's not many miles but it's something.

 

His response:

Tyler,

I have called al of the places you suggested, as well as the dealer and some other aftermarket suppliers. I put together a list of all the parts we will need in order to rebuild the engine (gaskets, bearings, seals, rings, lifters, etc. This came to about $2000.00. I added 25 %, then another $500 for miscellaneous parts. This comes to about $3100. This is the MINIMUM price, and there will most likely be hundreds in other hidden or surprise costs. Did you realize that by the time you break the engine in, using break-in oil and performing the first oil change after 30 minutes of running, and with other fluids, you will need about $100 in fluids? Did you consider the cost of machining? With a noise like you are experiencing you are either going to need a new crankshaft or machine work on yours. Either one will cost money and is not included in this quote.

You will likely need to machine one or more connecting rods. Chances are very high that your cylinders are damaged and may need to be machined and sleeved (oversized pistons are not available for your car). Did you add in shipping costs? Taxes? Did you consider that you might find a broken motor mount, a cracked hose or belt, etc? You wouldn’t want to spend all of that money on your engine, and then not replace a bad hose or thermostat. If you have metal in your engine oil you may need to flush or possibly replace your oil cooler, or you will be rebuilding the engine again. It is just reality that a car that old will have a few problems and that they will all add to the cost of the repair.

This is a bare-bones price. No one can tell exactly what parts will need to be replaced until the engine is apart, and it is very likely that there are other worn or damaged parts. I am sorry, but no matter what your forum friends tell you, their prices are unrealistic. If you can find someone who can rebuild your engine for $1500.00, by all means, go ahead, but I must warn you that I believe they are exaggerating things a little bit and you will pay much more than that before it is done. I am not exaggerating, I am being realistic. You’ll eventually understand what I am talking about.

Professor ......

 

My response:

Professor,

Thanks again, and I do understand. Here's what I came up with, using http://www.britishpacific.com

I'm sure I'm wrong on a few of the part numbers but they are all supposedly for a 1996 Discovery.

STC1426 - Con Rod Bearing Set
1 @ $32.00 -> $32.00
STC4299 - Main Bearing Set
1 @ $34.98 -> $34.98
549911 - pilot bushing
1 @ $2.25 -> $2.25
ERR2944G - Cylinder Head Bolt Long
6 @ $2.00 -> $12.00
KKB103120 - Mountings
2 @ $5.75 -> $11.50
BPWBKT6 - Aftermarket Kit To XA410481
1 @ $94.64 -> $94.64
STC2823 - Overhaul (Block) Gasket Set
1 @ $20.75 -> $20.75
LUN000010G - Cruciform Packing Gasket
2 @ $1.50 -> $3.00
ERR6733G - exhaust manifold gasket
4 @ $8.00 -> $32.00
ERR6490 - Front Crankshaft Seal
1 @ $2.60 -> $2.60


To be continued...

 

ERR7280 - timing cover gasket
1 @ $4.75 -> $4.75
ERR1990 - gasket
1 @ $2.00 -> $2.00
602087G - Gasket Sump
1 @ $11.50 -> $11.50
ERR2429 - housing gasket
1 @ $0.00 -> $0.00
ERR4077 - Water Pump Gasket
1 @ $2.00 -> $2.00
ERR2640 - rear main seal
1 @ $2.50 -> $2.50
LVC100260 - Rocker Cover Gasket
2 @ $4.50 -> $9.00
LKJ500020 - Valley (Manifold) Gasket
1 @ $9.75 -> $9.75
ERR7283 - Valley Gasket Seal
2 @ $2.25 -> $4.50
ERR5553 - Piston and Rings Assembly
8 @ $65.30 -> $522.40
ERC7929 - timing chain
1 @ $12.00 -> $12.00
LGH000040 - exhaust valve
8 @ $10.50 -> $84.00
LGH000030 - intake valve
8 @ $9.00 -> $72.00
602153 - rocker arm, right handed
8 @ $7.35 -> $58.80
611659L - rocker shaft
2 @ $18.75 -> $37.50
ERC4949GEN - Tappets
16 @ $15.00 -> $240.00
LGJ000030 - valve guide
16 @ $24.00 -> $384.00
ERR1782 - intake valve stem seals
8 @ $1.00 -> $8.00
ERR4628 - valve spring
16 @ $2.75 -> $44.00

Total is around $1750. I can source a new cam with free shipping for $150 which brings it to $1900 as a near worst-case scenario for parts. Granted that does not include sleeves if needed, nor does it include new pushrods or a crankshaft if needed. However it does include all gaskets and seals, all new pistons, and quite a few parts that are often not replaced. I have generally thought that not all valves and valve guides need be replaced, only if they are worn. Am I mistaken in this? Because if even half the valves and guides are good we can take out over $250. If half the pistons are good (and I suspect they all are fine) and need rings only it would save us another $200 or more. Throw in $1200 for wiggle room if you like. So parts, including the cam, could easily be as low as $1900 minus $250 minus $200 = $1450, not a far cry from the number I first stated. Price could come in lower still if all or nearly all the pistons and valves are usable.

Add in $200 for fluids and shop supplies, 50 hours of labor at $7/hour, and your range would be $2000 to $3200 plus any machine work. How is it that our numbers are so far off? Being in the construction industry I am quite familiar with complex bids, and having done all my own vehicle repairs for the past decade I do have a general idea about auto repairs.

So what have I overlooked? If I have even a 50% chance of the build coming in under $3000 I'd love to have you do it. But if there are large quantities of parts that I've overlooked then it will probably not be worthwhile. If I have to I'm sure I can run this engine for another year or two until I have time to rebuild it myself.

Tyler