Hydrogen Install to 4.6L V8 - 20-25mpg
Three Wheeling
Joined: Apr 2021
Posts: 83
Likes: 1
So... you're also claiming that this setup somehow harnesses the heat energy from the alternator? That's really the only significant "waste" energy.
There's always a certain amount of the rotational energy that gets lost as heat. That happens whether there is load or not, although it does vary. But the regulator setup means that if you reduce the electrical demand on the alternator, you also reduce the energy required to rotate it, reducing fuel consumption. That's why hypermilers will turn off every single thing on their vehicle that they possibly can, including warning lights and the like.
If you increase the electrical load on the alternator (e.g. by adding a device that produces hydrogen) then you increase the amount of force required to rotate the alternator, increasing fuel consumption and increasing your heat losses.
There's always a certain amount of the rotational energy that gets lost as heat. That happens whether there is load or not, although it does vary. But the regulator setup means that if you reduce the electrical demand on the alternator, you also reduce the energy required to rotate it, reducing fuel consumption. That's why hypermilers will turn off every single thing on their vehicle that they possibly can, including warning lights and the like.
If you increase the electrical load on the alternator (e.g. by adding a device that produces hydrogen) then you increase the amount of force required to rotate the alternator, increasing fuel consumption and increasing your heat losses.
I don't know anything about hypermilers, but I suspect they don't know much about how their alternator works. The alternator never turns off. This is confirmed by space shuttle and aerospace scientist John Caulkins.
John Caulkins, former Aerospace: DC-6 to Space Shuttle
Answered 3 years ago · Author has 196 answers and 1.1M answer views
No. But it would be better to talk in terms of specifics like voltage or amperage (current). As long as an alternator is turning, it is producing - as a minimum - residual voltage. If the stator is energized (magnetic field induced by current flowing through it), the voltage strength will rise. This rise will continue the same as water pressure in your garden hose will rise if you increase the opening of the water valve. But that is what voltage should be thought of as: pressure.
When the electrical pressure (voltage) reaches a level that is higher than the battery or other circuit voltage, this pressure overcomes the resistance and current flows. The current continues to flow into the circuit or battery until its resistance increases high enough to oppose the alternator voltage. This gross oversimplification totally ignores the role of the voltage regulator that controls the alternator, but the answer to your question is that the alternator still produces voltage even after the battery is fully charged.
https://www.quora.com/When-the-batte...ng-electricity
https://digital.library.unt.edu/ark:...1995_01002.pdf (page 11)
Answered 3 years ago · Author has 196 answers and 1.1M answer views
No. But it would be better to talk in terms of specifics like voltage or amperage (current). As long as an alternator is turning, it is producing - as a minimum - residual voltage. If the stator is energized (magnetic field induced by current flowing through it), the voltage strength will rise. This rise will continue the same as water pressure in your garden hose will rise if you increase the opening of the water valve. But that is what voltage should be thought of as: pressure.
When the electrical pressure (voltage) reaches a level that is higher than the battery or other circuit voltage, this pressure overcomes the resistance and current flows. The current continues to flow into the circuit or battery until its resistance increases high enough to oppose the alternator voltage. This gross oversimplification totally ignores the role of the voltage regulator that controls the alternator, but the answer to your question is that the alternator still produces voltage even after the battery is fully charged.
https://www.quora.com/When-the-batte...ng-electricity
https://digital.library.unt.edu/ark:...1995_01002.pdf (page 11)
Three Wheeling
Joined: Apr 2021
Posts: 83
Likes: 1
Just because you say something doesn't make it true. You need to provide evidence. I've done that. You haven't.
I'm still waiting for you to say something besides a put down. Say something that proves you even took high a single class of science in high school. You haven't so far. Explain how a car keeps running even with a dead battery... I'll be waiting.
Camel Trophy
Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 3,560
Likes: 834
From: Staten Island, NY
There you go with that "wasted energy" nonsense again. And I'm not touching the HHO part so you can shut up about that as a response.
An alternator doesn't produce much electrical energy if there is no demand. If you add an HHO generator, you increase the demand. Your wasted energy is a myth.
An alternator doesn't produce much electrical energy if there is no demand. If you add an HHO generator, you increase the demand. Your wasted energy is a myth.
Three Wheeling
Joined: Apr 2021
Posts: 83
Likes: 1
There you go with that "wasted energy" nonsense again. And I'm not touching the HHO part so you can shut up about that as a response.
An alternator doesn't produce much electrical energy if there is no demand. If you add an HHO generator, you increase the demand. Your wasted energy is a myth.
An alternator doesn't produce much electrical energy if there is no demand. If you add an HHO generator, you increase the demand. Your wasted energy is a myth.
Also most HHO devices are hooked directly to the battery, so the alternator is never doing more than charging the battery. Electrically it doesn't even know the HHO device is there except that it may need to keep charging the battery.
And if you are too confused by the alternator battery facts you can just put a solar panel on the top of your car/truck. So while you are parked at work or driving down the street it can produce HHO... the solar panel costs $84 for 100 watts or $168 for 200 watts. This has already been done and the experimenter said that he thought he could get about 100 liters of HHO gas in about 8 hours of sunlight using his 200 watt solar panels. Adding even a little HHO to the gasoline vapor mix could make a huge difference because it contains concentrated Oxygen along with the Hydrogen. The O alone would increase the octane rating of the gasoline.
There is a lot more going on than what the detractors on here and other places try to claim.
Some of the things going on most detractors here and in other places ignore are:
1) hydrogen has more than 3 times the potential energy of petroleum (gasoline) and HHO has oxygen in it to increase the power even beyond the "more than 3 times greater than gasoline"
2) the alternator is always wasting energy, it never stops running even when the regulator tries to turn it off
3) the HHO devices run off the battery not, the alternator directly so the alternator never sees the load
4) HHO contains oxygen and adding just concentrated oxygen to things makes them burns a lot hotter and faster, the oxygen alone is enough to make a difference
5) adding the HHO can allow you to decrease the amount of gasoline used and change the timing to use less gasoline
6) the HHO burns cool because it's only byproduct is water vapor, this cools the charge, so you get power and less heat so you can use less gasoline without detonating, it's like a water injection system perhaps
(and probably more)
Again I've never done this, but in theory it should have some effect, not sure how much it will really do, but it will do something.
Right here at the US Department of energy it says just adding oxygen to (any) hydrocarbon fuel you get the following benefits:
Benefits
Oxygen-enriched combustion can:
• Increase efficiency. The flue gas heat losses are reduced because the flue gas
mass decreases as it leaves the furnace. There is less nitrogen to carry heat from
the furnace.
• Lower emissions. Certain burners and oxy-fuel fired systems can achieve lower
levels of nitrogen oxide, carbon monoxide, and hydrocarbons.
• Improve temperature stability and heat transfer. Increasing the oxygen
content allows more stable combustion and higher combustion temperatures
that can lead to better heat transfer.
• Increase productivity. When a furnace has been converted to be oxygen
enriched, throughput can be increased for the same fuel input because of higher
flame temperature, increased heat transfer to the load, and reduced flue gas.
Using oxygen-enriched combustion for specific applications may improve efficiency, depending on the exhaust gas temperature and percentage of oxygen in the combustion air. Figure 2 can be used to calculate energy savings for commonly used process heating applications. The Process Heating Assessment and Survey Tool (PHAST) can also be used to estimate the amount of energy that can be saved by switching to oxygen-enriched combustion.
https://www.energy.gov/sites/prod/fi...ess_htgts3.pdf
Oxygen-enriched combustion can:
• Increase efficiency. The flue gas heat losses are reduced because the flue gas
mass decreases as it leaves the furnace. There is less nitrogen to carry heat from
the furnace.
• Lower emissions. Certain burners and oxy-fuel fired systems can achieve lower
levels of nitrogen oxide, carbon monoxide, and hydrocarbons.
• Improve temperature stability and heat transfer. Increasing the oxygen
content allows more stable combustion and higher combustion temperatures
that can lead to better heat transfer.
• Increase productivity. When a furnace has been converted to be oxygen
enriched, throughput can be increased for the same fuel input because of higher
flame temperature, increased heat transfer to the load, and reduced flue gas.
Using oxygen-enriched combustion for specific applications may improve efficiency, depending on the exhaust gas temperature and percentage of oxygen in the combustion air. Figure 2 can be used to calculate energy savings for commonly used process heating applications. The Process Heating Assessment and Survey Tool (PHAST) can also be used to estimate the amount of energy that can be saved by switching to oxygen-enriched combustion.
https://www.energy.gov/sites/prod/fi...ess_htgts3.pdf
Rock Crawling
Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 377
Likes: 94
Three Wheeling
Joined: Apr 2021
Posts: 83
Likes: 1
This experiment by VIT University in Vellore, India shows that there is a 4% to 8% increase in diesel fuel economy just by changing the oxygen percentage in a diesel engine from 21% to 27% by volume and it decreased the pollution by as much as 60% at the same time. So, the science behind HHO generators really is proven, but it could be the oxygen, not the hydrogen that is making most of the increased MPG.
This is the basics of fuels and is pretty well known how oxygen greatly increases oxidation... (it's even in the word.)
Oxygen enriched combustion is one of the attractive combustion technologies to control pollution and improve combustion in diesel engines. An experimental test was conducted on a single cylinder direct injection diesel engine to study the impact of oxygen enrichment on pollution and performance parameters by increasing the oxygen concentration of intake air from 21 to 27% by volume. The tests results show that the combustion process was improved as there is an increase in thermal efficiency of 4 to 8 percent and decrease in brake specific fuel consumption of 5 to 12 percent. There is also a substantial decrease in unburned hydro carbon, carbon mono-oxide and smoke density levels to the maximum of 40, 55 and 60 percent respectively. However, there is a considerable increase in nitrogen oxide emissions due to increased combustion temperature and extra oxygen available which needs to be addressed.
https://www.sciencedirect.com/scienc...15098615001445
https://www.sciencedirect.com/scienc...15098615001445
Camel Trophy
Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 3,560
Likes: 834
From: Staten Island, NY
You're a pretty obvious narcissist troll, who won't listen to anybody but yourself and all the conspiracy theories you've dug up. You appear to have little basic understanding of physics or electronics.
As many others have said, if you're so convinced of all of this, try it for yourself.
As many others have said, if you're so convinced of all of this, try it for yourself.
Three Wheeling
Joined: Apr 2021
Posts: 83
Likes: 1
This experiment by the University of Engineering and Technology in Pakistan and the Alternative Fuel Research Laboratory in Turkey and the College of Engineering and Technology in Pakistan and the Government of Punjab (and others) looked at the effects of combining HHO and diesel fuel.
Oxyhydrogen is the same thing as HHO, in case you didn't know.
The study showed, among other things, that HHO had the following effects.
This study at the National Research Center in Egypt, Fayoum University, and Al Azhar University showed that around 1 liter per minute of HHO can be produced at around 14-20 amps. Car batteries can produce about 3-4 amps.
This study at Jyothi Engineering College in India showed that there was up to 30% decrease in fuel consumption (MPG) by using HHO in addition to less pollution.
There are a lot more scientific studies going on around the world involving HHO and fuels, but I think that's enough for now.
Oxyhydrogen is the same thing as HHO, in case you didn't know.
The study showed, among other things, that HHO had the following effects.
Oxyhydrogen enriched diesel gives significant increase in torque and power output.
https://www.sciencedirect.com/scienc...60319921010247
https://www.sciencedirect.com/scienc...60319921010247
This study at the National Research Center in Egypt, Fayoum University, and Al Azhar University showed that around 1 liter per minute of HHO can be produced at around 14-20 amps. Car batteries can produce about 3-4 amps.
The production peak values for wet cell were 975, 1160, 1325 and 1375 ml/min at 5, 10, 15 and 20 g/L of NaOH and flow currents of 17.8, 23.5, 26 and 27 A and remains constant after 90 min.
https://www.sciencedirect.com/scienc...60319921002056
https://www.sciencedirect.com/scienc...60319921002056
This study at Jyothi Engineering College in India showed that there was up to 30% decrease in fuel consumption (MPG) by using HHO in addition to less pollution.
A decrease in specific fuel consumption was observed which ranged from (20% to 30%) along with a decrease in CO and HC emissions on an average of 18%and 14%respectively.
https://www.sciencedirect.com/scienc...14785318329675
https://www.sciencedirect.com/scienc...14785318329675
There are a lot more scientific studies going on around the world involving HHO and fuels, but I think that's enough for now.
Three Wheeling
Joined: Apr 2021
Posts: 83
Likes: 1
You're a pretty obvious narcissist troll, who won't listen to anybody but yourself and all the conspiracy theories you've dug up. You appear to have little basic understanding of physics or electronics.
As many others have said, if you're so convinced of all of this, try it for yourself.
As many others have said, if you're so convinced of all of this, try it for yourself.
Really?
This experiment by the University of Engineering and Technology in Pakistan and the Alternative Fuel Research Laboratory in Turkey and the College of Engineering and Technology in Pakistan and the Government of Punjab (and others) looked at the effects of combining HHO and diesel fuel.
Oxyhydrogen is the same thing as HHO, in case you didn't know.
The study showed, among other things, that HHO had the following effects.
Quote:
Oxyhydrogen enriched diesel gives significant increase in torque and power output.
https://www.sciencedirect.com/scienc...60319921010247
This study at the National Research Center in Egypt, Fayoum University, and Al Azhar University showed that around 1 liter per minute of HHO can be produced at around 14-20 amps. Car batteries can produce about 3-4 amps.
Quote:
The production peak values for wet cell were 975, 1160, 1325 and 1375 ml/min at 5, 10, 15 and 20 g/L of NaOH and flow currents of 17.8, 23.5, 26 and 27 A and remains constant after 90 min.
https://www.sciencedirect.com/scienc...60319921002056
This study at Jyothi Engineering College in India showed that there was up to 30% decrease in fuel consumption (MPG) by using HHO in addition to less pollution.
Quote:
A decrease in specific fuel consumption was observed which ranged from (20% to 30%) along with a decrease in CO and HC emissions on an average of 18%and 14%respectively.
https://www.sciencedirect.com/scienc...14785318329675
There are a lot more scientific studies going on around the world involving HHO and fuels, but I think that's enough for now.
Oxyhydrogen is the same thing as HHO, in case you didn't know.
The study showed, among other things, that HHO had the following effects.
Quote:
Oxyhydrogen enriched diesel gives significant increase in torque and power output.
https://www.sciencedirect.com/scienc...60319921010247
This study at the National Research Center in Egypt, Fayoum University, and Al Azhar University showed that around 1 liter per minute of HHO can be produced at around 14-20 amps. Car batteries can produce about 3-4 amps.
Quote:
The production peak values for wet cell were 975, 1160, 1325 and 1375 ml/min at 5, 10, 15 and 20 g/L of NaOH and flow currents of 17.8, 23.5, 26 and 27 A and remains constant after 90 min.
https://www.sciencedirect.com/scienc...60319921002056
This study at Jyothi Engineering College in India showed that there was up to 30% decrease in fuel consumption (MPG) by using HHO in addition to less pollution.
Quote:
A decrease in specific fuel consumption was observed which ranged from (20% to 30%) along with a decrease in CO and HC emissions on an average of 18%and 14%respectively.
https://www.sciencedirect.com/scienc...14785318329675
There are a lot more scientific studies going on around the world involving HHO and fuels, but I think that's enough for now.