Ok, I'm going to take a differentand possibly less popularstance here. While I agree it seems premature for the pump to fail at 36kmiles, and yeah, it would be nice if Land Rover picked up the bill oroffered to pay a portion as a good-will gesture, lets face it, the vehicleis 5 years old. Warrantys are acontract with a definedbeginning and end and a price that is calculated to cover aspecified level of risk.No manufacturer of any product can afford to carry a warranty ad-infantum or they'll go broke.Now, if there is a recall that you can take advantage of, great. If the warranty has indeed expired I think you're being a crybaby to even ask them to cover it. Your current financial situation is not germain to the situation.

I'd like to share a story: I bought a used truck once from a dealer who I had bought a number of vehicles from in the past. It was a trade he took in late that afternoon - I was there when the guy came in and bought a new truck. Given the time of day, there wasn't any time to inspect it. Therefore it wasn't inspected or anything. I turned around and bought it 'As-Is, No Warranty' and got a pretty good deal on it. I drove it all of 85 miles and it spun a bearing! It ran great up to that point. I was in another state about 500 miles from home. I shook my head, licked my woundsand moved on (I bought another truck and towed the first one home and replaced the engine --it turned out to be a nice vehicle). I didn't even call the dealer back.The problemwasn't anything he or anybody else could have predicted. Let's face it, I took a chance and the dice didn't roll my way. It was my responsibility, not theirs. Had it been inspected, and a 30 day warranty included, it would have been different. I hate cry-baby's and I don't want to be one. There is such a large number of people these days that think they have some sort of entitlement or 'deserve' "Justice", especially with cars. GET OVER IT! Get it fixed and go on with life. You'll sleep better knowing you didn't have to resort to lying or conn the dealer into paying out of their pocket for something you aren't contractually entitled to. Yeah, there may be a higher than normal failure rate for 03 oil pumps, but it's been 5 years. Your Disco is made up of thousands of mechanical components that wear. Land Rover cannot cover all of them beyond warranty just to make you happy or compensate for your financial shorcomings. That sounds course, but I believe it to be true.

I work for a company and while the vast majority of our customers are great peoplewho understand how business is conducted,you always have a couple cry-baby's that continually think they're entitled to more than the contract stipulates. We go the extra mile to exceed our customer's expectations but when we don't and it's legitimate, we will cover costs and do what's necessary to make it right with the customer. When a customer is asking for more than they are entitled to, its sometimes a difficult conversation to explain that they have to bear the burden of costs. Good communication is the key to not pissing the customer off. It sounds like L/R might not have done a good job in this regard.

So, I don't think Land Rover "Screwed" you. Rather, from what I read, you're trying to screw Land Rover and they put their foot down and have elected not tocover costs they are not entitled to. Sorry, for your situation, I've been very broke before (sometimes still am) and I empathize with your situation.

 

Mark G in addition to being terribly verbose your pontification is annoying to say the least. Give the guy a break........Land Rover should have done a recall on those 03 oil pumps .....period. Ive driven Porsches, BMW, a 1999 D II for for way more than five years and never had an oil pump go !

 

Like I said, I knew my position wasn't going to sit well,it's not a popular thing to say. I wasn't sayingthe oil pump shouldn't have lasted longer. I totally agree that it should have. I'd be angry too! I agree it's a bummer for the owner. It's one of Land Rover's shortcomings. But if it isn't covered under warranty or a recall, it's time to own up to the realization that not everything in life is fair.It's a 5 year old vehicle. A bearing or other mechanical part, including a major engine component, could fail tomorrow w/o any warning. I knew a farmer who had a 10 year old farm truck that has 20,000 miles. It was rusted out and pretty beat up. Should the motor still be covered under warranty? Trying to wrench money out of the dealership only increases the costs for everyone else.

 

Mark,

In general I agree with much of what you write, and have taken it in the shorts a few times myself when a product didn't last as long as I thought it should, or had problems with cars after I bought them as is...with nary a complaint to the business. I just didn't go back.

In my opinion, this case is very different for a few reasons:
[ol][*]This is a known manufacturing defect that has affected thousands of 2003 model year vehicles.[*]The defect affects a specific part of the car which is normally expected to last the life of the vehicle or longer.[*]The nature of the defect makes it impossible (or impractical) to know precisely which vehicles willexperience the problem in order to take corrective action.[*]It would have been discovered under the warranty period hadthe ownerdriven the vehicle more in the first few calendar years.[/ol]
My father had a 1984 Olds Cutlass Supreme that turned out to have the infamous (and undersized) THM-200 transmission installed in it from the factory. They had been substituted in thousands of cars when the normal (stronger) transmission was unavailable for whatever reason. Like most, it failed before 40K miles and GM told him it was his problem. After buying only GM cars for 30 years, that Cutlass was the last GM vehicle he ever owned.

The point of sharing this story with you is that while I agree that a company cannot support a product indefinitely or they'll go broke, it's also true that they won't be in business long if they fail meet the reasonable expectations of their owners. A reasonable person should expect their oil pump to last longer than 5 years. In this case, I believe it isfair for this gentleman to expect support from Land Rover.

Remember alsothat a significant premium was paid for thistruck over comparable vehicles when new. It's not like he bought a Kia where price was the primary consideration.

Dave

 

well put geo
If memory serves me right, LR's stance is that the ONLY authorized repair was a new engine block & front coverfor said front cover/oil pump repair.
This is because there was a slight misalignment of dowel pins in block from factory on some engine blocks.
The result was prestress to front cover/oil pump housing on assembly.

They aggressively discourage replacing only the front cover, how's that for quality?

P.S. I only frequent the parts counter @ the afore-mentioned LR dealer

 

If there was NOT a TSB then I would agree that he needs to suck it up, but they knew about the problem back in 2003 and did nothing.
There should have been a recall once the problem was found and fixed once and for all.

 

Precisely.

This is not a premature speaker failure or condensation in the headlamp issue this is a major issue and, as admitted in their TSB, caused by a manufacturing error. Not even a design error, parts were put on vehicles that were not as they were intended to be. The remedy is not a $6 fix it's a $6K fix and they've known about it since the beginning. Who knows, they prob knew as they were coming off the line.

As for warranty, given the nature of the problem the issue was present while the vehicle was under warranty. While the issue may not have made itself apparent until after the warranty period it was present during coverage none the less. As far as that goes I know my vehicle is in the range and under warranty, ergo odds are that the issue is present yet they will do nothing to correct it or even check it for that matter... until the pump or whole engine goes at which time it may be out of warranty. How does it make sense that, should it go, I get stuck with the bill?

Perhaps those of us with vehicles in the range and still under warranty should adopt the same moral compass as Land Rover and find a way to "accelerate" the failure since there will obviously be no remedy offered on the part of Land Rover.

This is not an issue about people being cry-babies or feeling entitled and to label it as such is purely illogical.

 

This entire issuewas a manufacturing problem compounded by a series of judgement errors. Engines built correctly do not have oil pumps that granade themselves. Sometimes quality problems creep into manufacturing. It's not a good thing,and if mishandled it can be a serious blow to a manufacturer's reputation. The key to minimizing the effect is to handle it right.

No one buys an automobile, especially an expensive automobile, with the expectation of an oil pump going out. When there's a series of these incidents, it points to a manufacturing defect. In LR's case, they even acknowledged that andissued a TSB. At this point, it should have been over. A reputable company would have boughtevery engine that exploded. When you acknowledge a manufacturing defect, it's a "fitness for merchantability" problem, not a warranty problem. Paying for their screwup wasthe right thing to do to protect theirreputationand brand.

It would be interesting to really know the discussions that went on inside the board room on this issue. I'm not sure who owned LR in 2003, but it was certainly between BMW and Ford. I think possibly the latter. I suspect there were execs that wanted to do the right thing, but may have been overruled in the end by the owners. In the end, the owners are responsible for everything, either from omission or commission. Quite frankly, I'm surprised that there hasn't been a class action before now.

 

Lucky me! Looks like I am going to be in the same boat. My 03 Disco has 62K miles. The oil pressure light went on and shortly thereafter my Engine light came on. The engine is running very rough and has a burning smell. However, it has not seized up like so many other's......yet.

I just had the oil changed to Mobile-1 2K miles ago. Oil level is good.

I found the TSB announcement and wouldn't you know, my VIN is within range. I need to take it to the shop, an hour away. We'll see what kind of mess I get into....


BTW, here's the TSB announcement:

"TECHNICAL ALERT
March 14, 2003 TA03 1201

2003 Discovery Series II Oil Pump Failures
Vehicles Affected
Discovery Series II (LT) 3A771801 – 3A808362

Situation
Oil pump failures on 2003 Discovery Series II vehicles may be the result of a
manufacturing error. Locating dowel pins may be slightly misaligned permitting
assembly of the oil pump to the engine block, but placing stress on the pump housing
which can ultimately lead to leakage or failure.

Resolution
Whenever an oil pump failure is encountered on vehicles within the above VIN range
the only effective repair currently available is replacement of the complete engine
assembly including the front cover/oil pump manufactured to the latest tolerances.
Use the following components to affect a repair:
• LBB112301 4.6 Engine assembly LEV
• LBB111461 4.6 Engine assembly NON-LEV"

 

Are you in the vin range? My 03 is not but I fear the future! LOL