I have a temporary solution to my problem, which will serve until I find another field vehicle not hamstrung by a poorly implemented electrical system. Camping Mode is never happening and I cannot have a vehicle that will just wheeze out while I am 75 miles into a field site. I just don't feel like walking that far and most of the places I go have no hope of ever getting cell service. Don't get me started on satellite stuff.

The solution is adding a 20AH LiFe battery under the access hatch in the 90. There is limited space in the 90 under there, so it is pretty much as big as I can squeeze under there without mods to the vehicle. I want to keep it as un-modified as I can, since I feel that my time with this one will be ultimately short lived compared to my others. The battery connects to a box with has three 12V outlets, a voltage/current meter and a USB-C and USB-A device that puts out a true 60W, not like the feeble ones installed in the car. It is connected to a quick release on the wires and can be removed in seconds. The battery is separate from the vehicle's system. Heaven forbid I should tap into its limited, life threatenly small amount of reserve power. It does however get recharged by the system when the engine is running through the wiring to the 12V outlet in the rear of the vehicle. A position I have no idea why it is there, since it shuts off when the car is off and leaves it without power while you might need it powering something in the rear or out of the car. The box I made has a mystery switch. Never use it unless thee is an electricity low situation, like when I opened the door this morning. What it does is trip the relay that powers the 12V outlet and connects the two systems together without the engine running. It allows the little battery to level off the main battery and give it enough juice after a couple of minutes to start. The relay has a little wrap of wire around the leg that trips the relay when ground is applied (!). I just ran a wire out of the box to hook up to the magic box.


There Magic box in place

Platform for the extra battery

Battery in place

The purple yellow wire that is the hot for the 12V outlet

THe outlet pulled out, getting to the backside is unecessarily difficult

Wiring of the Magic Box is simple and straight forward

USB outlet

Kind of here it hangs out without my sliders and drawers

wire snaking out from the relay

Wire wrapped around the trip leg of the relay

 

Nice job figuring that out.

Is this vehicle a no-go for someone who intends it to be a camping vehicle because of the battery drain issue?

 

Why not just keep a small jump start portable jump start battery in the car and a battery cut off switch installed under the passenger seat panel. ?

 

Not necessarily. A lot depends on what trim level you got and the number of electrical do dads it came with. Vehicles with fewer gizmos, like clearsight mirror, many of the driving enhancements, cameras, radar units warning systems. Seems that most of these systems are kind of like having another laptop computer drawing off the system. If you manage your door opening (10 amps for 10 minute draw) and perhaps place a solar panel, then it would be fine (I do this as well). Or bring a jump starter along, I have one that doubles as a compressor. Then it should be fine. Just never had a vehicle I had to have the equivalent of of Blue RotoPax (electrical) cans to go into the field with.

 

This is kind of a permanent equivalent of a jump start I don't have to pull out or drag along, hook up and so on. Just flip the switch on the relay. I do need to charge stuff when stopped for a day or two and I already have a bunch of stuff in the car and really you can't charge much with the installed battery, that and the ports either shut off or are anemic. Like when I went out to model this impact crater. Ran the drones for several hours, shared stuff powered the D-RTK ground station and so on. All this stuff requires power. My old Range Rover had plenty, not so with this one.

 

Dogpilot: Regarding pic 4, that spaghetti needs some good marinara, LOL. During many years of electrical contracting, I’ve opened up panels that look like that. And shake my head how someone can call themselves an electrician, and why the building didn’t burn to the ground long ago. Seeing your level of understanding of electronics, I’m sure that’s your cut-off bin. Nice sense of humor though.

 

2 things that seem concerning to me. Just giving some feedback. Hope that is ok.

1. you are connecting the lithium battery directly to your vehicles electrical system to let it get charged. Normally a big no-no to connect lithium directly to a vehicle charging system. They typically require a dc to dc smart charger to prevent overcharging unless you have something like this already. In addition, lithium and agm in the same system is also not suggested for similar reasons.

​​​​​​2. Using a lithium battery to try to help start the vehicle when the vehicle battery gets too low is also not suggested. The vehicle starter motor will draw well into 140 amps creating a large power surge from the batteries. Lithium does not do well with this type of current surge.

Not trying to be critical. I like your problem solving approach to your unique concern. Finding a way to charge with solar to try to offset the draw of constantly waking up the vehicle and/or adding more agm batteries to the system may help. Not sure how lithium can be used to help your current problem. Lithium is fantastic, but it does have some drawbacks and nuances to consider compared to agm or lead acid. Keep us posted on your progress.

 

Actually I believe the vehicle battery is Lithium, kind of why it is so expensive and has a charge tracker built into the terminals. As I mentioned, I do not use this as a start assist, but rather a charge leveler (it would need massive wirie). I have done a similar install before in my old Range Rover, mainly just to run the cooler box. I had it more aligned to be recharged by a generator while in the field. The LiFe batteries are a lot more durable and seem to be for more easy going on how they are charged. My first run at this was again, in the Range Rover. I had something similar, but earlier version of the LiFe battery. While at Renegade Burn, we did manage to flatten the Range Rover's battery, in spite of using a generator to run most everything. We were using the RR as a projection Booth to run our "Rick & Morty" theater, have a roof top tent and cook out of. I didn't have it set up to do the charge leveling on the relay system. So I had to jump the relay, worked like a charm. Leveled off the two in about 5 minutes and started right up. The wiring on this is set, fuse wise for 15 amps. The system is still installed in the RR and is going strong now (my bud has the car now in Telluride) since January 2021. Range Rover is a Lead Acid system.

I do have a solar system, in fact three different ones. It is a pain and to put any substantial charge on the system and tun stuff you need at least two panels. It is just more junk to haul around. I already have around 6 boxes of equipment to do my research with me. Everything from a microscope to a ground station. I could carry a lot more in the Range Rove, I had thought a 110, but I find it a bit too large for the places I go. I have almost always stuck with 90's and 88's for maneuverability. More stuff would just turn the poor 90 into a Mexican Bus.

The poor Range Rover had fits with the Playa dust. When we first got there it threw up around 10 codes. All of which cleared, but managed to produce a few more during the week, they cleared. Did a few more on the way out, and we stopped at a spray booth place in Fallon and cleaned it up a lot and it drove code less and fine back home. I think some of the codes put the system in such fits that it was part of its vampire draw. It had never run down in the field before. Also points to the value of always having a code scanner in modern cars.

 

I start by saying how disappointing it is that the car consumes so much power just because a door is open. Ten amps!? That's nuts, and Land Rover should get serious about reducing this, or shutting things down more quickly, or at least by adding a "camping mode." Who wants to worry about waking up to a dead car!?

People have tried battery cutoffs? What does that do to the car when you wake it up again? All normal, or does it throw fits?

I've used LiFePO4 batteries in the field before (in Antarctica, actually), coincidentally also 20 Ah each. They were custom packs with a charge controller that did cell balancing. Does your lithium battery have an integrated charge controller? Most encapsulated batteries like that should. If so, that's fine. If not, the battery will not last very long. At least they are relatively safe compared to Li-ion.

If starting the car requires 140A, then that's "7C" (140A/20Ah). This is an acceptable discharge rate, at least for a short time, and assuming that the wiring and connectors, etc., are up to the load.

If you have a non-hybrid car, then I doubt that the car's own battery is lithium. It would more likely be lead-acid, e.g. AGM.

Your solution is fancy, but as mentioned there are lithium starter accessories available which wouldn't require a custom install and are occasionally useful for other purposes (charging your phone, etc.). Get a good one, since many are shoddy, lie about their capacity and are even unsafe. The same goes for the sort of battery pack you used too. Far too many companies, even very well known and presumably reputable ones, use junk cells and charge controllers without cell balancing, etc. A bad experience with one is why I went with my own custom solution for critical field use.

Do consider upgrading to a phone with emergency satellite messaging or some other device like that (my iPhone has that feature). Don't scoff, they are becoming common, and one day it could save you. (I had a satellite phone with me while camped on the ice 100 miles from the next human.)

I had a laugh at the spaghetti too. But, uh, did you really just wrap some bare wire around the relay terminal and shove it back in? Some sketchy details here and there for sure.

 

My phone has satellite SOS, I have a Garmin Inreach as well. My complete distrust of satellite crap comes from projects in Borneo. Very steep topography, most rugged place I ever worked. Satellite window was 3 minutes out of every 15, due to the very restricted horizon from the topography. It was totally frustrating to use the phone, took forever to send text, like 4 hours. Then, you had to stand outside in clear view of the sky. If you have ever worked in the jungle, it means your standing in pouring rain, which tends to fall every evening. The Garmin takes quite some time to deliver messages as well. Used it quite a bit in Africa, mainly Namibia and South Africa. Then they are all frightfully expensive if you have any kind of reasonable data/voice package. Pigeons are cheaper more reliable and delicious in a pinch.

I have several iterations of batteries in a box (one that doubles as a music system). It is just one more piece of kit rattling around and weighing down the back of the car. I can hook up the magic box or, just plug a socket into the connector. No space no more box count. I have everything everybody has suggested, they are all excellent suggestions, it all is pretty much a fail and just adds more stuff to the back of the car. Have tested it in the field, spent tons of money on it, regret buying any of it. I even had more, been piecing it out on Expedition Portal over the last 6 months.

As for it dying, who cares, it is $60 delivered! So far the other one has persisted in the same state since 2021 and still kicking. I spend more than $60 driving each time, down and back to Land Rover North Scottsdale to have the battery replaced twice a year on warranty. It eats batteries at 4 times the rate it needs oil changed! Thank god I got the special extra pissy long term coverage. Paid for itself in batteries alone. Again, it is not for starting. It just tops off the battery when you flip the switch, (you flip it off before starting) think of it more like a portable version of the CTEK. Which was again plugged into my car all day yesterday, since it was moaning for electricity, like the German Soldiers in "Sahara" where moaning for wasser, wasser.

So really what would you rather cart around, spend time setting up, then packing it all back in:

This gigantic pile-o-crud

Or this connector

and this connector