Front End Question
#11
Please, CHECK YOUR TOE IN... I went completely thru the front end on mine and still didn't fix the death wobble.. Turned out it was toe'd out way too far and the track rod was frozen so even by turning a tie rod end it was still too far out or too far in...
Finally fixed the track rod adjuster and got it set right and now guess what.. NO more death rattle..
With the axle on stands and the front wheels off.. Measure the distance between the front and rear sides of the front brake rotors.....
This measurement should be essentially the same number except the front is a little big and the rear is a little small. They should just split a line.. I think on mine it was 53.5" or close to that... Check it... I'll bet you'll find your problem there...The toe out is 2mm....That's not much...
Also check the bolts holding the steering box to the frame...
John
Check this...
Finally fixed the track rod adjuster and got it set right and now guess what.. NO more death rattle..
With the axle on stands and the front wheels off.. Measure the distance between the front and rear sides of the front brake rotors.....
This measurement should be essentially the same number except the front is a little big and the rear is a little small. They should just split a line.. I think on mine it was 53.5" or close to that... Check it... I'll bet you'll find your problem there...The toe out is 2mm....That's not much...
Also check the bolts holding the steering box to the frame...
John
Check this...
With the condition of the thrust washers and my tie rod ends I'm going to replace them anyways. With the new ends I'll need to adjust my toe in anyways.
All the parts are on order. I'll update one I get it all back together.
#12
You'd better start looking at that track rod... Check the adjuster section and see if it can be moved... It took me days to finally free mine...
I filled it with ATF/Acetone mixture and beat it with a hammer for several minutes with several repetitions... Then I was fortunate enough to have a pipe vise to put the thing in and got on it with a three foot pipe wrench...
I was trying to break it when it finally freed up...
If you can't adjust that.. I'll guarantee nothing else you will do will help...
Good Luck
John
I filled it with ATF/Acetone mixture and beat it with a hammer for several minutes with several repetitions... Then I was fortunate enough to have a pipe vise to put the thing in and got on it with a three foot pipe wrench...
I was trying to break it when it finally freed up...
If you can't adjust that.. I'll guarantee nothing else you will do will help...
Good Luck
John
#13
You'd better start looking at that track rod... Check the adjuster section and see if it can be moved... It took me days to finally free mine...
I filled it with ATF/Acetone mixture and beat it with a hammer for several minutes with several repetitions... Then I was fortunate enough to have a pipe vise to put the thing in and got on it with a three foot pipe wrench...
I was trying to break it when it finally freed up...
If you can't adjust that.. I'll guarantee nothing else you will do will help...
Good Luck
John
I filled it with ATF/Acetone mixture and beat it with a hammer for several minutes with several repetitions... Then I was fortunate enough to have a pipe vise to put the thing in and got on it with a three foot pipe wrench...
I was trying to break it when it finally freed up...
If you can't adjust that.. I'll guarantee nothing else you will do will help...
Good Luck
John
After doing a body off restore on a 95 Wrangler I know all about rust and stuck nuts/bolts!
#14
Snot gonna be fun...
John
#15
I need your all's opinion. I have it tore down this far:
The swivel ball on this side is good and the seal is good. Is should I go in further and replace anything?
Here is what the swivel ball looks like on the passenger side:
That's the only place it's pitted and doesn't seem to be leaking there either.
I'm far enough into this project that I don't want to be taking shortcuts and have to go in latter and fix more stuff.
Thanks for your help and advice!
The swivel ball on this side is good and the seal is good. Is should I go in further and replace anything?
Here is what the swivel ball looks like on the passenger side:
That's the only place it's pitted and doesn't seem to be leaking there either.
I'm far enough into this project that I don't want to be taking shortcuts and have to go in latter and fix more stuff.
Thanks for your help and advice!
#16
#17
Check the panhard bushings.
To do this.
Have one person wiggle the steering back and forth with the engine running.
Other person looks for wobble in the panhard bushing.
I bet that is it.
OIL rots the rubber.
You'll see play in the panhard bushing.
These are on the long thick rod-
on each end wheel to wheel.
To do this.
Have one person wiggle the steering back and forth with the engine running.
Other person looks for wobble in the panhard bushing.
I bet that is it.
OIL rots the rubber.
You'll see play in the panhard bushing.
These are on the long thick rod-
on each end wheel to wheel.
#18
Was just troubleshooting death wobble. Checked toe out is correct. Wheel bearings were loose from new 6000 miles ago, tightened those but wobble was getting worse. Steering shaft checked good. Dropped drag link to check the steering box. The knuckle (pitman) rattled but less than 1mm. Tightened the adjusting nut half a turn and locked it. It checked tight then. Wobble seemed to get worse.
The good thing is the death wobble was so bad I got plenty of practice coping with it. I mean, let's face it, if it happens to most people it scares the death out of them. It did me too and a sane reaction is to slow down and stop and then drive carefully (slow) so it doesn't happen again until you get home and fix it. But then you realize you got yourself a Land Rover and you might as well have a good laugh, because you've just got to have a good sense of humour to own one of these things for long, so why not give it a bit of a go?
I tried some experiments to deal with it. Braking down to a low speed stops it of course. Hard acceleration does not stop it. I could steer with it going on but only very poorly. Interestingly, driving into the shoulder and off road stops it even without slowing down. It can occur on hard packed dirt but it seems soft surfaces dampen out the oscillations enough to prevent it. That's great to know because I've always thought that what most people consider crashing off the road, for the Land Rover driver is just taking a bit of a short cut.
Was dreading it might be swivel pin bearings which were preload adjusted (one shim removed) also 6k ago. Checked and found the axle panhard bushing was so shot you could rattle the whole rod 3mm with your hand. Only 4k on that bushing too, which is why I didn't consider it at first. It's always dry, no oil. All the leaks are on the other side.
Since a new rubber bushing only lasted 4000 miles, maybe I should try poly?
The good thing is the death wobble was so bad I got plenty of practice coping with it. I mean, let's face it, if it happens to most people it scares the death out of them. It did me too and a sane reaction is to slow down and stop and then drive carefully (slow) so it doesn't happen again until you get home and fix it. But then you realize you got yourself a Land Rover and you might as well have a good laugh, because you've just got to have a good sense of humour to own one of these things for long, so why not give it a bit of a go?
I tried some experiments to deal with it. Braking down to a low speed stops it of course. Hard acceleration does not stop it. I could steer with it going on but only very poorly. Interestingly, driving into the shoulder and off road stops it even without slowing down. It can occur on hard packed dirt but it seems soft surfaces dampen out the oscillations enough to prevent it. That's great to know because I've always thought that what most people consider crashing off the road, for the Land Rover driver is just taking a bit of a short cut.
Was dreading it might be swivel pin bearings which were preload adjusted (one shim removed) also 6k ago. Checked and found the axle panhard bushing was so shot you could rattle the whole rod 3mm with your hand. Only 4k on that bushing too, which is why I didn't consider it at first. It's always dry, no oil. All the leaks are on the other side.
Since a new rubber bushing only lasted 4000 miles, maybe I should try poly?
#19
Final Update:::
It took a bit to get the project finished due to waiting on parts. While I was waiting on parts I worked on getting some things cleaned up and getting the tire rod ends off and getting the adjuster freed up.
Here is what I replaced:
All 4 ball joints
All front wheel bearings
Thrust washers and needle bearings on the top swivel pins.
New upper swivel pin shims and the pre-load set.
The pan hard rod has been replaced with an HD one and it has new polly bushings.
I got all the work done and filled my swivel ***** with the one shot grease packs. I also set my alignment as best as possible.
Took it for a test drive and it removed the death wobbles!! It still had a slight vibration and the steering wheel was a little off. We took it in for a tire balance and alignment. After the tires were balanced and the front end aligned it drives like it's supposed to. They also straitened the steering wheel for me when they did the alignment.
Here are some pictures of the final product:
It took a bit to get the project finished due to waiting on parts. While I was waiting on parts I worked on getting some things cleaned up and getting the tire rod ends off and getting the adjuster freed up.
Here is what I replaced:
All 4 ball joints
All front wheel bearings
Thrust washers and needle bearings on the top swivel pins.
New upper swivel pin shims and the pre-load set.
The pan hard rod has been replaced with an HD one and it has new polly bushings.
I got all the work done and filled my swivel ***** with the one shot grease packs. I also set my alignment as best as possible.
Took it for a test drive and it removed the death wobbles!! It still had a slight vibration and the steering wheel was a little off. We took it in for a tire balance and alignment. After the tires were balanced and the front end aligned it drives like it's supposed to. They also straitened the steering wheel for me when they did the alignment.
Here are some pictures of the final product: