End of my rope with the throttle body heater leaking.
#11
05-05-2020, 07:17 PM
Super Moderator
If you live in a warn climate plug it up. If you live in a cold climate you need the TB heater or the TB will stick in cold weather. I am personally against plugging it .This is an offroad vehicle and it's there for reason. And it does not have to be arctic cold for it to stick even a little. Also as Yellow rover says you may need to clean your TB. It is very easy to do. You only need to spray it out with TB cleaner and use a toothbrush. Buy a new gasket also.
Second just using TB Cleaner will NOT fully clean the TB. You truly need to remove the TB Plate itself and clean the outer edge with a scotchbrite pad, and then make sure the plate doesn't have a line inside the TB which it could "stick". If you just spray it with TB cleaner you are not fully cleaning the surface which actually contacts the body of the TB.
The Bosch TBH plate is a **** poor design with 3 bolts holding it on which leaves the side with the 2 5/16 lines supported by one bolt. It should really should have been designed with a bolt in each corner, and if they had to make the lines come in from the bottom. I have seen plenty of Bosch D2/P38's slowly bleed to death while the owner was totally unaware they were loosing coolant.
Like I said the chance of it sticking is so ridiculously rare it's not even funny, but the chance of it leaking is extremely high so pick your poison. Bleed out slowly and cook the engine or go leak free until The Day After Tomorrow storm shows up and have a TB possibly stick while you catch a glimpse of Big Foot?
I know several people from Alaska with a RRC and a D2. The RRC still had it's TBH (it was a decent design with a good gasket), and the D2 they purchased from California. They did a big trip in the D2 after they flew down and picked it up. They went across the US to Atlanta, and then back up to Alaska. I got to meetup with them and I used my Nanocom to tweak some stuff from them. I looked under the hood of their D2 and the first thing I noticed was the TBH plate was seeping. I told em about it, and they kept an eye on it. Well somewhere on their way back they noticed in the morning they were a bit low on coolant, and they had a decent stretch of road to cover out in the middle of nowhere so I suggested before they leave town to bypass it. They did, and it stopped loosing coolant. On their way up to Alaska they hit a decent cold front/blizzard, and they had no problems. They've now been up in Alaska for 3 years without any issues.
Like I said in my earlier post the 3-4 threads I read about the TB sticking had nothing to back up their story. Was the TB dirty? Was a TB spring broken? Was the TB shaft/springs rusty? Was the TB Cable rusted or frayed?? Not a single one of the stories of the TB sticking ever post any useful info. They post how deadly it was, and as quickly as they posted it they never update the thread and that's the end of it. Kinda like running out of gas down a 7 mile mountain pass, and loosing braking power kind of story IMHO lol.
Last edited by Best4x4; 05-05-2020 at 07:32 PM.
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OverRover (05-05-2020)
#12
05-05-2020, 07:41 PM
Super Moderator
On that 02 Westminster I had several years ago as a project fixer upper every single thing under the hood was just a collection of RUST. The 4spd Transmission cable was rusted to the bracket, and the bracket rusted off the shaft, and the threads rusted off the shaft leaving a nub I barely got a new bracket welded to it. Then the TB itself = just an orange blob. The cables were very rough, the springs were orange, and the nut which holds everything onto the TB shaft was so bad I couldn't even get it loose without stripping the rusty blob threads off the shaft. I gave up, tossed it, the TBH into the trash, grabbed the spare TB which was one of the original 2 I had stick at WOT (stuck in hot/cold didn't matter but once I removed both TB plates, and cleaned em they were smooth as silk). I installed it along with a new throttle cable, and it was good to go, but nothing on that original TB could be saved. So what I'm getting at here is usually where you have cold climates you have treated roads where you end up with corrosion from the said treated roads which "could" certainly lead to causing TB springs to rust, shafts to rust, cables to rust, and TB's to stick. Not saying that is the cause, but it's certainly an explanation more detailed than OMG my D2 TB Froze up and stuck, and I nearly died.....
Last edited by Best4x4; 05-05-2020 at 07:44 PM.
#13
05-05-2020, 08:23 PM
TReK
First I'm going to say that not all vehicles even come with a TBH plate and plenty of them are in cold climates with ZERO issues.
Second just using TB Cleaner will NOT fully clean the TB. You truly need to remove the TB Plate itself and clean the outer edge with a scotchbrite pad, and then make sure the plate doesn't have a line inside the TB which it could "stick". If you just spray it with TB cleaner you are not fully cleaning the surface which actually contacts the body of the TB.
The Bosch TBH plate is a **** poor design with 3 bolts holding it on which leaves the side with the 2 5/16 lines supported by one bolt. It should really should have been designed with a bolt in each corner, and if they had to make the lines come in from the bottom. I have seen plenty of Bosch D2/P38's slowly bleed to death while the owner was totally unaware they were loosing coolant.
Like I said the chance of it sticking is so ridiculously rare it's not even funny, but the chance of it leaking is extremely high so pick your poison. Bleed out slowly and cook the engine or go leak free until The Day After Tomorrow storm shows up and have a TB possibly stick while you catch a glimpse of Big Foot?
I know several people from Alaska with a RRC and a D2. The RRC still had it's TBH (it was a decent design with a good gasket), and the D2 they purchased from California. They did a big trip in the D2 after they flew down and picked it up. They went across the US to Atlanta, and then back up to Alaska. I got to meetup with them and I used my Nanocom to tweak some stuff from them. I looked under the hood of their D2 and the first thing I noticed was the TBH plate was seeping. I told em about it, and they kept an eye on it. Well somewhere on their way back they noticed in the morning they were a bit low on coolant, and they had a decent stretch of road to cover out in the middle of nowhere so I suggested before they leave town to bypass it. They did, and it stopped loosing coolant. On their way up to Alaska they hit a decent cold front/blizzard, and they had no problems. They've now been up in Alaska for 3 years without any issues.
Like I said in my earlier post the 3-4 threads I read about the TB sticking had nothing to back up their story. Was the TB dirty? Was a TB spring broken? Was the TB shaft/springs rusty? Was the TB Cable rusted or frayed?? Not a single one of the stories of the TB sticking ever post any useful info. They post how deadly it was, and as quickly as they posted it they never update the thread and that's the end of it. Kinda like running out of gas down a 7 mile mountain pass, and loosing braking power kind of story IMHO lol.
Second just using TB Cleaner will NOT fully clean the TB. You truly need to remove the TB Plate itself and clean the outer edge with a scotchbrite pad, and then make sure the plate doesn't have a line inside the TB which it could "stick". If you just spray it with TB cleaner you are not fully cleaning the surface which actually contacts the body of the TB.
The Bosch TBH plate is a **** poor design with 3 bolts holding it on which leaves the side with the 2 5/16 lines supported by one bolt. It should really should have been designed with a bolt in each corner, and if they had to make the lines come in from the bottom. I have seen plenty of Bosch D2/P38's slowly bleed to death while the owner was totally unaware they were loosing coolant.
Like I said the chance of it sticking is so ridiculously rare it's not even funny, but the chance of it leaking is extremely high so pick your poison. Bleed out slowly and cook the engine or go leak free until The Day After Tomorrow storm shows up and have a TB possibly stick while you catch a glimpse of Big Foot?
I know several people from Alaska with a RRC and a D2. The RRC still had it's TBH (it was a decent design with a good gasket), and the D2 they purchased from California. They did a big trip in the D2 after they flew down and picked it up. They went across the US to Atlanta, and then back up to Alaska. I got to meetup with them and I used my Nanocom to tweak some stuff from them. I looked under the hood of their D2 and the first thing I noticed was the TBH plate was seeping. I told em about it, and they kept an eye on it. Well somewhere on their way back they noticed in the morning they were a bit low on coolant, and they had a decent stretch of road to cover out in the middle of nowhere so I suggested before they leave town to bypass it. They did, and it stopped loosing coolant. On their way up to Alaska they hit a decent cold front/blizzard, and they had no problems. They've now been up in Alaska for 3 years without any issues.
Like I said in my earlier post the 3-4 threads I read about the TB sticking had nothing to back up their story. Was the TB dirty? Was a TB spring broken? Was the TB shaft/springs rusty? Was the TB Cable rusted or frayed?? Not a single one of the stories of the TB sticking ever post any useful info. They post how deadly it was, and as quickly as they posted it they never update the thread and that's the end of it. Kinda like running out of gas down a 7 mile mountain pass, and loosing braking power kind of story IMHO lol.
im just going by experience. When ever it hits cold cold like -20 Celsius and I’m on the highway it sometimes sticks. Not like it takes off. You just feel it still going s bit when you lift your foot. I’m not disagreeing with 4x4 just my own experience. This only happen twice in 2 years
#14
05-05-2020, 08:44 PM
Super Moderator
Have you ever taken that TB off, and removed the cables to check them, or removed the TB plate and made sure it was absolutely smooth? They had a recall way back in the day for D2 throttle cable issues.
Might be a good idea to check all that stuff. Whenever I get a D2 I personally always remove the TB (for the TBH removal lol) but at the same time I remove the 3 screws holding the TB plate, and I use very fine sandpaper or a scotchbrite pad and make sure the outer edge is absolutely smooth, and if there is a line inside the TB housing I rub the sandpaper or scotchbrite in there as well. You want it absolutely clean, and smooth. The two I had stick at WOT looked perfectly clean, but they would stick at WOT in your hand without a cable hooked up to it or anything. After I tore them both down and just cleaned the TB Bore, and the plate itself on the leading edge I put em back together and they wouldn't stick no matter what I tried. I was so confident I slapped back on my spare parts shelf and they're both out cruising around to this day. Once I do it like that I normally don't have to do that for a very very very long time or unless it's nasty. I think the last time I did it on my Kalahari was right at 5 years now.
Might be a good idea to check all that stuff. Whenever I get a D2 I personally always remove the TB (for the TBH removal lol) but at the same time I remove the 3 screws holding the TB plate, and I use very fine sandpaper or a scotchbrite pad and make sure the outer edge is absolutely smooth, and if there is a line inside the TB housing I rub the sandpaper or scotchbrite in there as well. You want it absolutely clean, and smooth. The two I had stick at WOT looked perfectly clean, but they would stick at WOT in your hand without a cable hooked up to it or anything. After I tore them both down and just cleaned the TB Bore, and the plate itself on the leading edge I put em back together and they wouldn't stick no matter what I tried. I was so confident I slapped back on my spare parts shelf and they're both out cruising around to this day. Once I do it like that I normally don't have to do that for a very very very long time or unless it's nasty. I think the last time I did it on my Kalahari was right at 5 years now.
#15
05-05-2020, 09:13 PM
TReK
Have you ever taken that TB off, and removed the cables to check them, or removed the TB plate and made sure it was absolutely smooth? They had a recall way back in the day for D2 throttle cable issues.
Might be a good idea to check all that stuff. Whenever I get a D2 I personally always remove the TB (for the TBH removal lol) but at the same time I remove the 3 screws holding the TB plate, and I use very fine sandpaper or a scotchbrite pad and make sure the outer edge is absolutely smooth, and if there is a line inside the TB housing I rub the sandpaper or scotchbrite in there as well. You want it absolutely clean, and smooth. The two I had stick at WOT looked perfectly clean, but they would stick at WOT in your hand without a cable hooked up to it or anything. After I tore them both down and just cleaned the TB Bore, and the plate itself on the leading edge I put em back together and they wouldn't stick no matter what I tried. I was so confident I slapped back on my spare parts shelf and they're both out cruising around to this day. Once I do it like that I normally don't have to do that for a very very very long time or unless it's nasty. I think the last time I did it on my Kalahari was right at 5 years now.
Might be a good idea to check all that stuff. Whenever I get a D2 I personally always remove the TB (for the TBH removal lol) but at the same time I remove the 3 screws holding the TB plate, and I use very fine sandpaper or a scotchbrite pad and make sure the outer edge is absolutely smooth, and if there is a line inside the TB housing I rub the sandpaper or scotchbrite in there as well. You want it absolutely clean, and smooth. The two I had stick at WOT looked perfectly clean, but they would stick at WOT in your hand without a cable hooked up to it or anything. After I tore them both down and just cleaned the TB Bore, and the plate itself on the leading edge I put em back together and they wouldn't stick no matter what I tried. I was so confident I slapped back on my spare parts shelf and they're both out cruising around to this day. Once I do it like that I normally don't have to do that for a very very very long time or unless it's nasty. I think the last time I did it on my Kalahari was right at 5 years now.
Anyway it’s never been on my list to take something apart that works fine. Way to many other things to worry about and I would have to be at wot for it to stick that way. Which I’m never at wot unless I pass someone on the highway.
Anyway I hope the op good luck on getting this fixed of bypassed
#16
05-06-2020, 02:50 AM
Look at Professor know it all lecturing down to me from his podium ... Yes sir, yes sir,. I agree completely with everything you say sir. I need a good grade from you for my Rover MBA degree. Yes sir, Professor Kalahari, I will go outside right now and unplug the throttle body heater hoses yes sir. I will give it it's first Vasectomy. Will snip and plug those hoses up with some such right away and report back. Yes sir.
Ya or maybe this is not a University and I'm allowed to have a different opinion? The TBH is there for a reason. Yes I did have it stick in single digit weather before. Wind chill. The cold air strikes the clean or gunked metal plate creating a temperature variance which makes it stick. That's Thermodynamics. Your friends in Alaska not withstanding. I do have a reason for wanting it. And it was put there for a reason. If you want to take something designed by the original engineers that's an integral to the engine and plug it up with golf tees and clips that' your choice of course. I don't like that sloppiness in my engine. So I will maintain the Rover as it was originally designed.
Ya or maybe this is not a University and I'm allowed to have a different opinion? The TBH is there for a reason. Yes I did have it stick in single digit weather before. Wind chill. The cold air strikes the clean or gunked metal plate creating a temperature variance which makes it stick. That's Thermodynamics. Your friends in Alaska not withstanding. I do have a reason for wanting it. And it was put there for a reason. If you want to take something designed by the original engineers that's an integral to the engine and plug it up with golf tees and clips that' your choice of course. I don't like that sloppiness in my engine. So I will maintain the Rover as it was originally designed.
Sigh
Wind chill has no effect on metal. Look it up.
As explained here countless times, throttle body icing is possible given the right (wrong?) circumstances of temperature and humidity, combined with the venturi effect. Its incidence is not solely an effect of whether or not the vehicle is operated in a cold climate. In fact, many cold climates typically are low humidity, making throttle body icing less likely.
But that's really beside the point. Lashing out at Best4x4 like LeatherBoots did is uncalled for. We all know that Best4x4 is among the most solid contributors here, and what he posts is backed up by years of experience with many DIIs. He is not given to hair-brained schemes like some on this forum.
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NewToTheTwo (05-07-2020)
#17
05-06-2020, 04:17 AM
Camel Trophy
great idea @Best4x4 for the 1000 grit and scotchbright. I have my IM off of the engine and will knock this out.
Btw... I'm another with the TB bypassed with the hose going back to the coolant tank. No TB issues with surviving the heat of Atlanta and the cold of England.
Btw... I'm another with the TB bypassed with the hose going back to the coolant tank. No TB issues with surviving the heat of Atlanta and the cold of England.
Last edited by JUKE179r; 05-06-2020 at 04:20 AM.
#18
05-06-2020, 12:42 PM
Super Moderator
Some people just aren't made for online forums I guess. Bottom line it's not my car so do as you wish. When I go to a local salvage yard and see a D2 or P38 that died a slow death from a TBH leaking I will raise my drink of choice to those that stuck by LR (their engineers are far from perfect) and thank you for the 50.00 ARB, 50.00 rear metal bumper, 30.00 rocker guards, and 25.00 perfect leather seats
Did LR create a good PCV setup for the D2??? Nope, but I sure did!!
Did LR create a good PCV setup for the D2??? Nope, but I sure did!!
#19
05-06-2020, 02:05 PM
TReK
Some people just aren't made for online forums I guess. Bottom line it's not my car so do as you wish. When I go to a local salvage yard and see a D2 or P38 that died a slow death from a TBH leaking I will raise my drink of choice to those that stuck by LR (their engineers are far from perfect) and thank you for the 50.00 ARB, 50.00 rear metal bumper, 30.00 rocker guards, and 25.00 perfect leather seats
Did LR create a good PCV setup for the D2??? Nope, but I sure did!!
Did LR create a good PCV setup for the D2??? Nope, but I sure did!!
you guys hace nice salvage yards
Here in Canada all I can find is usually one beat up old disco usually 99-2000 stripped to crap
#20
05-06-2020, 02:21 PM
Camel Trophy
If you reeeeeeeeeeally want to keep using your TBH on your V8, there is a remanufactured silicone gasket from British Parts of Utah that is sold. It keeps that warm fuzzy in your heat of having hot coolant warming up your throttle valve plate area.
https://www.britishpartsofutah.com/P...010KS&CartID=1
But to LeatherUggs... what do I know having my TBH bypassed during 100 degrees + humidity weather in Atlanta, Georgia to having -10 degrees weather in Cambridge, England.
‘ave a nut mate... Back to me pint of ale... Cheers
https://www.britishpartsofutah.com/P...010KS&CartID=1
But to LeatherUggs... what do I know having my TBH bypassed during 100 degrees + humidity weather in Atlanta, Georgia to having -10 degrees weather in Cambridge, England.
‘ave a nut mate... Back to me pint of ale... Cheers
Last edited by JUKE179r; 05-06-2020 at 02:26 PM.
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Best4x4 (05-06-2020)