Discovery II Talk about the Land Rover Discovery II within.
Sponsored by:
Sponsored by:

Fuel trim after rebuild

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
Old Oct 31, 2018 | 11:27 PM
  #1  
Llamasayswhat's Avatar
Thread Starter
|
Rock Crawling
Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 450
Likes: 81
From: Kailua Kona, HI
Default Fuel trim after rebuild

Recently finished my 4.6 rebuild(crower cam, new cam bearings, head gaskets, compete new cooling system, new front cover and oil pump assembly, new injectors, new every seal I could possibly get my hands on) and my fuel trims are wacked the heck out.

I initially had 2 vacuum leaks on reassembly(cracked vacuum fitting for the booster connection, leaking clamps on the IAC valve) which I rectified and reset my adaptations afterwards. Within 5-10 miles, my LTFT will be about 20% on both banks and my short term fluctuates from -3 to +9 or so across different throttle and load conditions. upstream sensors appear to be cycling correctly, and rears appear to do their job as well when watching the voltages with my scan tool. MAF is reading about 10grams at idle and maxes out at 100 under WOT(don't know if those 2 figures are right)

I set a p0174 twice in quick succession this past weekend when cruising on the highway, but it cleared and 60+ miles since, and no returning faults.

Any ideas? I have smoked the system and I see no vacuum leaks anywhere
 
Reply
Old Oct 31, 2018 | 11:39 PM
  #2  
Jason_B's Avatar
Winching
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 517
Likes: 62
From: Oceanside CA
Default

What should the values be? I am interested in looking into this after getting my new engine.
 
Reply
Old Oct 31, 2018 | 11:55 PM
  #3  
Llamasayswhat's Avatar
Thread Starter
|
Rock Crawling
Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 450
Likes: 81
From: Kailua Kona, HI
Default

LTFT is the car adjusting its base fuel settings to account for issues in the running condition. Ideally? your LTFT should be 0, that would indicate that everything is running perfect and the car is not compensating for anything. A high positive fuel trim means the car is adding fuel to combat an issue, and the reverse is witholding fuel to combat an issue. STFT should just fluctuate no more than a handful of % points

I don't know what our gram flow rate for the MAF is supposed to be, to be honest
 
Reply
Old Nov 1, 2018 | 12:08 AM
  #4  
No Doubt's Avatar
Recovery Vehicle
Joined: Jun 2017
Posts: 1,238
Likes: 240
From: Alabama + Vegas + Texas
Default

I'd think that you have a leak or a blockage in either the vacuum, intake, or exhaust. Easy to check the exhaust by duct taping a shop vac to a cold exhaust tailpipe with motor off and listening.


Also possible to have a cracked/blocked/faulty O2 sensor?
 
Reply
Old Nov 1, 2018 | 12:38 AM
  #5  
razorkill12's Avatar
Mudding
Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 161
Likes: 39
From: Fort Collins, Co
Default

Check fuel pressure when engine has warmed up. I'm assuming its +20 so its running lean. I went through the 171/174 code thing. Redid head gaskets because they started to leak...did injectors ,etc while in there. Put all back together and LTFT was badly leaning out on both banks...all vac hoses had already ben replaced. Checked fuel pressure and it was 20 psi....spec is 50.. I couldn't believe that engine drove and ran with only 20 psi...lol.. Replaced fuel pump and now fuel trims good.
 
Reply
Old Nov 1, 2018 | 12:56 AM
  #6  
Llamasayswhat's Avatar
Thread Starter
|
Rock Crawling
Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 450
Likes: 81
From: Kailua Kona, HI
Default

Can fuel pressure be read with a scan tool? My gut was pointing to that next but i do not want to dig around at the back of the intake for that Damn schrader valve.
 
Reply
Old Nov 1, 2018 | 07:22 AM
  #7  
Sandman614's Avatar
Recovery Vehicle
Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 825
Likes: 171
From: Raleigh, NC
Default

Originally Posted by Jason_B
What should the values be? I am interested in looking into this after getting my new engine.
LTFT outside of +/- 10% will throw a too lean/rich code I believe.
 
Reply
Old Nov 1, 2018 | 07:43 AM
  #8  
mln01's Avatar
Camel Trophy
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 3,883
Likes: 951
From: Charlotte
Default

Originally Posted by Llamasayswhat
LTFT is the car adjusting its base fuel settings to account for issues in the running condition. Ideally? your LTFT should be 0, that would indicate that everything is running perfect and the car is not compensating for anything. A high positive fuel trim means the car is adding fuel to combat an issue, and the reverse is witholding fuel to combat an issue. STFT should just fluctuate no more than a handful of % points.t
While it makes sense that LTFT should ideally be zero that is rare. In my truck it is typically somewhere in the -5%/+5% range.

Ideally STFT should fluctuate between -5% and +5%. That's normal. Readings from 5-10% either way are not uncommon however, but they should not persist and if they occur STFT should return reasonably quickly to the 05%/+5% range.
 

Last edited by mln01; Nov 1, 2018 at 11:41 AM.
Reply
Old Nov 1, 2018 | 10:07 AM
  #9  
Jeff Blake's Avatar
Pro Wrench
Joined: May 2016
Posts: 1,617
Likes: 184
From: Lake Tahoe
Default

Only way to read fuel pressure is through the shraeder valve

Same thing happened to me with my rebuild, I was around 7%-12% LTFT and intermittent/pending P0101, P0441, P0505, 121. I can't be certain what actually fixed it, but now I sit exactly at 1.56% LTFT with no fluctuation.

I suggest picking up a cheap intake pressure pressure ($15 bucks) and testing the vacuum in the intake. You can also use it test if the exhaust is clogged.

Some things I did
- redid intake manifold gasket
- replaced brand new genuine purge valve with a Hyundai unit (go figure)
- replaced MAF
- new air filter, o-ring
- new fuel pump (bosch)
- different brand spark plugs (in the OE spec heat range)
 
Reply
Old Nov 1, 2018 | 08:49 PM
  #10  
Llamasayswhat's Avatar
Thread Starter
|
Rock Crawling
Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 450
Likes: 81
From: Kailua Kona, HI
Default

Checked the fuel pressure today after work, steady 50, and when revved it blips down to about 45 and then returns to 50. Car off, pressure falls to about 45 and holds there indefinitely, looks like the pump is OK

I did smoke it again, and I do have a small vacuum leak... coming out of the throttle shaft of the throttle body looks like I will need a new throttle body unless there is an available seal option for the throttle shaft
 
Reply



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 07:34 AM.