Hi All,

My wife's 2011 RRS, 5.0 NA has me baffled. Just a short background; I am quite mechanically inclined but it's been a couple decades since I really tore into in engine. I am not well versed in modern engines so I'm an old dog learning new tricks. Forgive me if I am not up on the lingo.

Truck ran fine but was getting progressively louder. Has 72k miles on it. Figured out it was the timing chains and decided that I wasn't about to pay several grand to have it done. Many hours of reading and YouTube, (and the requisite boatload of new specialty tools!) and I was able to do it over the course of a couple weeks. Had to do the alternator which was ruined by a leak from the oil cooler which I did not find until I started the chains. Somebody stripped out 5 or more of the screws that mount it to the block so I had to drill those out and install heili-coils. What an unexpected detour that was! Did crossover tube, thermostat and hoses at the same time. Started up and ran decent for a couple weeks CEL came on and it was showing bank 2 cat over temp. About the same time, noticed fuel smell. Found #6 injector leaking. Pulled the rail and replaced seals. Buttoned up but ran very rough with misfires all over bank 2 and #6 injector was leaking again. Now getting a lot of white smoke on start-up and continuously thereafter. Decided to replace the coils on bank 2 AND put in 4 "new" refurb injectors from E-bay. Very carefully re-installed fuel injectors and finally seemed to get them all to seat and seal properly - no leak. Sill misfiring all of bank 2. Bank 1 is fine so I have not touched it since the chain job. Plugs looked pretty good but put in 4 new ones just to try something. Still bank 2 misfiring, barely able to idle. After checking the PCV membranes,(they were OK but man, the damn tabs on the covers SUCK!) I pulled the plugs and found #2 had not fired at all - clean white porcelain. 4,6,8 were all pretty black.

So, just did a spark test on bank 2 - all good. While cranking for the spark test noticed #2 was shooting out a mist of fuel and did so for quite awhile until I presume it finally cleared out the raw fuel that was sitting in there. The fuel relay was pulled and there was noting coming out of the other cylinders. Did a compression test: #2 215 psi, #4 220, #6 240 #8 240 Although #2 is lowest, it still seems decent right?

At this point I'm not sure where to turn. I have the old injectors and could swap out #2 but I'm wondering if there is anything else to try first??? I feel like something is amiss with bank 2 overall but the fact that #2 has not fired makes me think I need to concentrate there.

My wife is convince that I should have ponied up 8 or 10K to do the timing chain job because "obviously, you didn't do it right!" ...arrrrgh!!! Would be very grateful for any help!

 

I'm thinking I might re-assemble everything and try starting it with the #2 injector wire disconnected. If that injector is bad and somehow stuck open then I'll know that's the reason for all the fuel in there and likely the misfire. Does this sound like a good plan? Is there any other reason I could have all that fuel in there besides a bad injector? The fact that that injector is a "new" injector already makes me wonder.

 

UPDATE! Before putting everything back together I pulled out my Klein boroscope. (A highly recommended purchase - less than 50 bucks at Home Depot in the electrical tools dept - my best tool purchase in many years!) While looking in the #2 cylinder I noticed it seemed wet. As soon as reinstalled the fuel relay and turned the ignition on, a shower of fuel was pouring from the "new" injector! On further testing, I determined that this was a mechanical issue with the injector being stuck open. I'm a bit upset that I have wasted so much time chasing down a problem with a supposedly NEW part! Guess those E-Bay injectors weren't the deal I thought they were!

Prior to installing the new injectors I still had a problem but I am thinking that it was either one of the coil packs, which I replaced, or one or more of the old injectors was also faulty. After installing one of the old injectors in #2, the idle smoothed out and I was able to drive the truck a little test drive. No more heavy white smoke and a good idle, if not just a tad lumpy. One of my PCV valves was hissing a bit because I broke a couple of the tabs trying to check it. Once that was firmly in place, the idle smoothed out nicely. Unfortunately, #2 injector was leaking a bit. Since I used aftermarket seals and have removed and reinstalled the fuel rail a few times, this is probably to be expected. I picked up a full set of genuine injector seals and will install those, very carefully, and I'm hoping I will be in good shape.

If anyone has any tips or tricks for installing the fuel rail and injectors, please post! I seem to be lousy at getting them to seal. In one of the Atlantic British videos, he mentions putting just a little Vaseline on the seals to help them ease into the fuel rail. I have done that a couple times but I'm not having good luck! Any advice?

 

Hi All,

While I'm having this conversation with myself, I figured that some day another user might read it and save themselves time and money. I was not so lucky.

My initial problems seem to be related to coil and/or fuel injectors that were not functioning well after I did the timing chains. I did also install the seal backer (gray split washer thingy under the injector seal) backwards on my first re-assembly - that ended up causing the seal failure. The biggest problem by far though was the "NEW" injectors I bought on E-Bay! On receiving them, they were obviously remanufactured and were dated 2015. I should have returned them immediately - but I did not. Of the 4 I bought for bank 2, one of them was positively stuck wide open right from the box - this I confirmed with my boroscope after exploring a bunch of other avenues and pulling my hair out. Another of the NEW injectors had a crack in the body where there were some abrasions on the plastic. I thought were just cosmetic - they were not. I verified this after thinking it was a bad seal. After replacing them all super carefully with new genuine LR seals, I still had a leak. Upon removing the fuel rail very carefully once again, I was able to see where the injector had been leaking out the side. The area below the seal was dry as a bone. (As they often do with injectors that have previously been removed or replaced, the injectors came out connected to the manifold with seals still holding them in.) The "New" injector in #8 was also showing signs of running very rich - misfires and carbon on the plug. After I bought a set of actual new injectors from a reputable online store, the truck ran smooth and quiet! So caveat emptor, as they say! I wasted a LOT of time and money on parts that probably did not need replacing because I thought that "NEW" injectors on eBay were actually going to work properly.

The last issue I'm facing is a persistent P0430 code on bank 2. I am guessing that running so rich on bank 2 fouled up the cat on that side, if not the O2 sensor as well. My plan is to run a bottole (or two) of CatAClean and see if I can clear it. If anyone has any ideas or advice on this I'd sure appreciate it!

Thanks!
Sean

 

You're having this conversation with yourself because it's not in the RRS forum.

 

Thanks Mollusc! That explains it - leave it to a newbie, right!? Guess I should have figured that out.

Any way to get the thread moved? I might just copy over the posts to the RRS area so that at least they will be in the right place for future readers - unless I'll get in trouble for that - IDK if it's a breach of etiquette.. ?

 

Cautionary tale: driving with the stuck injector fried my bank 2 cat. After the engine was running fairly good again, with new injectors on B2, I was getting a persistent cat under performance DCT. (P430 iirc) I tried 2 bottles of Cataclean with no effect. Finally used my scan tool to graph out the upper and lower O2 sensors and found that the B2 cat was indeed toast. (Later verrified with my boroscope) If you are suspecting a bad O2 sensor, do yourself a favor and search youtube for Schrodingers Box and watch his video on O2 sensor diagnosis. Might save you a bunch of time and parts! Wish I had found it sooner! Here is the link:


Good luck!

 

this conversation with yourself because it's not in the RRS forum.