engine wont start
#1
01-21-2012, 01:28 PM
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engine wont start
please help ive just changed my 4.6 1998 engine for a 99 had to change inlet manifold all the iccilaries its now fitted in but wont start the problem i have is the crankshaft sensor on the 98 it has 2 wires and on the99 it has 3 ive changed the sensors over still dont work please help at the end of my tether
#2
01-21-2012, 01:56 PM
Super Moderator
RAVE (97) shows a three wire sensor as being:
White - shield
Brown - sensor to pin 12 of ECU
Green - sensor to pin 11 of ECU
A sensor for a 99 D2 is:
Black - shield
Black yellow - to pin 32 on ECU
Pink black - to pin 46 on ECU
The sensor is a coil type sensor, and it picks up a pulses generated by the flywheel whizzing by 2 mm away. This low voltage signal controls many things by the ECU. Page attached from Bosch manual. Note that if the sensor wires are reversed, it makes timing three degrees off.
You should be able to meter connector, and have infinite ohms (no connection) between the ground (shield ) lead and other colors. You should have some sort of ohm reading, but not a dead short, across the colored wires, because it is a coil.
Remount of sensor is critical because of spacers. Page attached.
White - shield
Brown - sensor to pin 12 of ECU
Green - sensor to pin 11 of ECU
A sensor for a 99 D2 is:
Black - shield
Black yellow - to pin 32 on ECU
Pink black - to pin 46 on ECU
The sensor is a coil type sensor, and it picks up a pulses generated by the flywheel whizzing by 2 mm away. This low voltage signal controls many things by the ECU. Page attached from Bosch manual. Note that if the sensor wires are reversed, it makes timing three degrees off.
You should be able to meter connector, and have infinite ohms (no connection) between the ground (shield ) lead and other colors. You should have some sort of ohm reading, but not a dead short, across the colored wires, because it is a coil.
Remount of sensor is critical because of spacers. Page attached.
#3
01-21-2012, 02:05 PM
#4
01-21-2012, 09:52 PM
#5
01-21-2012, 10:28 PM
Super Moderator
From RAVE:
Spacers - from RAVE:
Note: Later engines are fitted with a modified
starter ring gear which incorporates the reluctor
plate, spacer and hub. The modified ring gear
may be fitted as a replacement to early
engines.
starter ring gear which incorporates the reluctor
plate, spacer and hub. The modified ring gear
may be fitted as a replacement to early
engines.
Spacers - from RAVE:
The above readings are dependent upon correct air gap between the tip of the CKP sensor and the passing teeth of
the reluctor ring. The correct air gap between the tip of the CKP sensor and the passing teeth of the reluctor ring can
be set by the correct fitting of a spacer as follows:
the reluctor ring. The correct air gap between the tip of the CKP sensor and the passing teeth of the reluctor ring can
be set by the correct fitting of a spacer as follows:
9.2 mm spacer for vehicles with manual gearbox fitted.
18 mm spacer for vehicles with automatic gearbox fitted.
18 mm spacer for vehicles with automatic gearbox fitted.
Basically, you want the tip of the sensor close to, but not touching the teeth of the plate. Like 1 - 2 mm. Touch, and game over. Too far back, not enough signal. Looks like there is also a spacer change if manual or automatic, must be something to do with size of plate . You also would not want metal filings building up on the tip. If you still have old block, perhaps you can make some measurements from the top of the teeth.
Last edited by Savannah Buzz; 01-21-2012 at 10:31 PM.
#6
01-22-2012, 05:41 AM
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Yes that's what I've done used top end of engine is gems bottom bosch but can I wire a 3 wire sensor into the 2 wire sensor
#7
01-22-2012, 05:54 AM
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Thankyou all for your tips
Ive got a Bosch bottom end and a gems top end the sensor for bottom end is 3 wires but loom is for the top which is gems everything connects apart from crank sensor because gems wire loom is 2 wire what can I do engine turns sparking but not fireing up is there a solution I've not took an engine out before this is my first it took me 7 days to take it out and put it back together a lot of hours and money please if you give any advice can you try not to be to technical please as I don't no the ins and out of an engine thankyou pls help
#8
01-22-2012, 08:22 AM
Super Moderator
OK -
1. What colors are the wires from the loom, and do they have a connector that fits the "new" sensor connector, and to be sure - is this sensor on the end of the block near the firewall (not the radiator)?
2. Do you have a voltmeter?
3. Where are you (North American Spec vehicles are slightly different, and released on different model years from rest of planet)?
4. Have you pressed the inertia switch to reset, or is it even hooked up? It breaks power to the fuel pump relay. Do you have fuel pressure at the schraeder valve?
Some concerns I would have would be that there are more than one sensor on the bottom of the engine, like cam position sensor in front cover. Old ECU may not like any of the new sensors. Any codes displayed for your scanner? Kind of hard to drag truck to auto parts store to read codes when it won't run).
5. Attached is wiring diagram from shop manual for 97-99. Its shows a "N" color wire (N = browN) and a "G" color wire (G= Green) that carry the signal from sensor to the ECU. The "W" (W=white) wire is a ground shield to block engine noise, it may not be presented in the connector, which has two pins. Those two pins go to green and brown wires.
On a three wire connector, the first two are the sensor and the third one is the ground wire. Pix attached from RAVE. You will have to use the first two, and just tape up the third, which should be black.
It will be possible that the connection is reversed, which will make timing 3 degrees off. Since you are getting spark, which would mean spacing is OK, then maybe this is part of the problem. Try reverse the two wires from loom.
re: it took me 7 days to take it out and put it back together a lot of hours and money please if you give any advice can you try not to be to technical please as I don't no the ins and out of an engine thankyou pls help
I would say that as a first, a week of wrenching, two engines sliced and diced, and it cranks and sparks, you've done well.
1. What colors are the wires from the loom, and do they have a connector that fits the "new" sensor connector, and to be sure - is this sensor on the end of the block near the firewall (not the radiator)?
2. Do you have a voltmeter?
3. Where are you (North American Spec vehicles are slightly different, and released on different model years from rest of planet)?
4. Have you pressed the inertia switch to reset, or is it even hooked up? It breaks power to the fuel pump relay. Do you have fuel pressure at the schraeder valve?
Some concerns I would have would be that there are more than one sensor on the bottom of the engine, like cam position sensor in front cover. Old ECU may not like any of the new sensors. Any codes displayed for your scanner? Kind of hard to drag truck to auto parts store to read codes when it won't run).
5. Attached is wiring diagram from shop manual for 97-99. Its shows a "N" color wire (N = browN) and a "G" color wire (G= Green) that carry the signal from sensor to the ECU. The "W" (W=white) wire is a ground shield to block engine noise, it may not be presented in the connector, which has two pins. Those two pins go to green and brown wires.
On a three wire connector, the first two are the sensor and the third one is the ground wire. Pix attached from RAVE. You will have to use the first two, and just tape up the third, which should be black.
It will be possible that the connection is reversed, which will make timing 3 degrees off. Since you are getting spark, which would mean spacing is OK, then maybe this is part of the problem. Try reverse the two wires from loom.
re: it took me 7 days to take it out and put it back together a lot of hours and money please if you give any advice can you try not to be to technical please as I don't no the ins and out of an engine thankyou pls help
I would say that as a first, a week of wrenching, two engines sliced and diced, and it cranks and sparks, you've done well.
#9
01-22-2012, 11:27 AM
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#10
01-22-2012, 12:26 PM