With all the talk of fossil fuels running out, vehicle manufactures going out of business and the lean towards electric powered cars - where do our Rovers stand? Will we all eventually scrap our classic Rovers (1948-2004 models) or are there any alternatives that would allow us to keep, maintain and enjoy our classic rovers well into the future?

I'm not ready to give up my passion for classic Land Rovers, and I've been considering a conversion to either diesel, electric, or hydrogen-petrol (but converting to diesel only prolongs the issue) and the issue with electric power is that it limits how you drive your vehicle. SUV's in general are generally to heavy for electric power, and such power is greatly reduced in colder climates and up hills - essentially using electric power would sacrifice most of the off-road capabilities land rover is renown for, in exchange for better more efficient MPG.

So what do you guys think? This is not a debate on weather global warming will happen, nor if fossils fuels will or will not run out in our lifetime, this is a debate about how to modify our Rovers for a worst case scenario without sacrificing off-road capabilities.

 

run it on wood.

 

A few months ago a large group of Model T's made a trek to Savannah. As a group most of those owners never owned a new one. But they have managed to keep things rolling. Between specialty fabricators and dismantlers, parts will be around for awhile. Really desparate owners will buy their own parts truck(s).

As for fossil fuels going away, very large geo-political forces at work there. The big oil firms make sure the right politicians are supported in many places. The small countries with oil flex their muscles. And any engineering solution would include conversion capability for retrofit, the market is too large to ignore.

Future things might be like VW Redefines 'Car' With A 170-MPG Diesel Hybrid | Autopia | Wired.com , and Ford Previews 100 MPG Fusion Energi at Boston Auto Show - Yahoo! News . There is talk of a new version of diesel engines that will reach above 100 mpg without hybrid.

Obviously the car companies will put these on the market to drop their overall MPG usage for regulators, and rising gas prices allows them to be sold at a premium price. Politicians will support them for the "front page" value of energy conservation; but also secretly love the idea of trapping the population into the cities and close-in metro areas so their tax dollars can be easily harvested for future wasting. Why did most people leave the cities? We didn't agree with how they were being run. Now we have lots of influence being exerted by appointed boards and regional commissions, bypass of the electoral practice is complete. And regional transportation sales tax.

Along the way we'll have plenty of suckers for magic chips that increase power and gas mpg by 314%.

Plus people will always pay for their "fun". I know a fellow in Savannah that purchased a 47 foot Hatteras boat, and docked it on the river behind his house. How much fuel does it carry? 600 gallons. How far can it go on that? Almost to Charleston. So for what I can do with 20 gallons driving on the road, he takes around 1400 (at marine prices) but has a lot more fun.

I'm always on the lookout for parts that will sub from more common vehicles, like the Chevy fan clutch. We, the unwilling, lead by the un-knowing, have repaired so much with so little for so long that we can maintain anything, forever, with nothing.

Rant over.

 

Here is the way it is going to go down.
Your "classic" Rover will become to expensive to drive any more than on the weekends or to take the grand kids to the park.
Gas will be who knows how much a gallon but it will be more than the average person can afford to "waste" on just driving around.
Your house will be powered with wind and solar and that is how you will charge your car.
Cars/trucks will be powered similar to the Chevy Volt and there will be quick chargers at all of the "gas" stations.
The petrol engine will be there for emergency use only or for towing a heavy load.
Parts for your Rover will be expensive, motor oil will be over $20 a qt.
The cost of global climate change will drive the cost of driving a gas guzzling suv out of reach of the average person.

 

Until we start producing so much oil and gas from areas not discovered and/or permitted yet, with fracture methods, injection, and techniques not yet discovered. Plus some young "Edison" will make the hydrogen system cost effective, and we'll grow more crops for ethanol like in South America.

For the moment you could decide on which government you like - in Caracas it is about 6 cents a gallon, but the government leans one way. In Saudi Arabia, around 50 cents. In Norway, about $9.50. So the real cost of fuel is heavily determined by politics. BTW, 28 Land Rover dealers in Norway, so even with almost triple our prices people still admire them enough to own one.

I think it will change, but it will be slow. Back in the 60's, gas for under a quarter in the US. Now it is way more than 10 times that, and we have not stopped driving yet.

Spike has a point about solar, make it super cheap and it will adopt faster. But don't turn the neighbor's kid loose with a BB gun. We can dream.

Anyone want to open that electric bill for July or August?

 

I already got my July electric bill, $280...OUCH MAN!!!
Our landlord installed a new central a/c unit as the old one was about 30yrs old and because she is super cheap she bought one that was to small for the house so it runs almost non stop.
Right now it is nice out, we have the windows open and the attic fan on.

With rebates and gov. tax incentives putting solar onto your house is almost free, they were just talking about this on Science Friday on NPR, tax rebate of $10,000 if I remember right, add to that the lower electric bill.
We are switching over to LED light bulbs as the incandescent burn out.
30,000hr life span and a 60w equalivant uses about 1w.
We are also looking at a Toshiba 40" LED tv since our old LCD has now dropped a few pixels.
$6yr for that tv compared to our current one of $24yr (estimated cost by the gov. standard usage/cost chart)

I really do not think increasing the cost of motor fuels and taxing the hell out of them is going to solve our problem, we are using more electricity then ever, every one has a smart phone that needs to be charged, lap tops, tablets, tv in every room, dvd player in every room, electronic billboards, tv's instead of menu's on the wall at fastfood joints like McDonalds and Burger King.
All of this powered by coal, nice dirty black smoke belching coal burning power plants.
All of that white smoke you see spewing from the smoke stacks at the power plants is supposed to be black but years ago someone figured out that if you just add ammonia to the exhaust it turns that black smoke white so it looks like steam.
I'm not a tree huggin' hippie, but I can see the forest through the tree's.

 

Good points all! You guys ever heard of Les Stroud? He's the guy from Survivorman. Aside from the show, he actually spends a lot of his time out in the Canadian bush. Him and his wife spent an entire year in the bush with no modern equitment save a radio for emergnecies. No metals, no wood, no vehicles etc. They lived off the land and built a little cabin without nails or anything. Now afew years later they are back out in the woods, this time they are investing in a "off the grid" lifestyle complete with a reconstructed cabin, wind energy, solar power and various water collection devices!

The point is that if you want to avoid that $250 electric bill every month, or the gas bill in the winter or even the $1000 rent payment every month then consider investing in a off the grid lifestyle in the woods. No rent, no electric no gas bills. You get privacy and you have one more excuse to own a land rover - need a capable 4x4 suv to get you through the bush!

This one shows you how Les Stroud went about living off the grid:
http://youtube.com/index?desktop_uri...?v=zjxHQrTm5f8


This one was a self filmed documentary of Less Stroud and his wife living completely off the land without any supplies - for a year:
http://youtube.com/index?desktop_uri...?v=vsevsFCwizY



From what I've read online, Hydrogen as a power source for vehicles, seems to be the most viable option for both new cars coming off the production line and our old clunkers. Seems there is a way to convert our older vehicles without swapping out the entire engine, and if I understand correctly the implication is that because hydrogen is clean, there will be zero emissions! We are always having bloody emissions issues with our rovers so I like this idea:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencete...ting-cars.html

Another option I came across (Haynes: "You and Your Land Rover Discovery. Buying, enjoying, maintaining , modifying) proposes LPG (liquid petroleum gas). Supposedly its:
- 75% less carbon monoxide
- 85% less hydrocarbons
- 40% less oxides of nitrogen
-87% less ozone forming potential
- 10% less carbon dioxide
When compared to petro. Also has similar comparisons to diesel. They sell entire kits which include special storage tanks, mounting kits and everything else you need for the conversion.

 

Oh and I forgot to mention that there's a Defender in the first video link: Off The Grid | A Family's Journey To Building An Off The Grid Home. If the link doesent work then type in the title on YouTube.

 

^^^YES!!!^^^ Personally I think the price of gas is really talked up in politics. I don't get why 3 years ago oil at $130 gas was cheaper than now when oil is $90. You can say inflation and whatever but if you look at the global money issues everyone is running out of money except China, India, Sudia Arabia and a few others...
I do also recognize we are running out of fossil fuels, so why not start more solar, wind, geo thermal, hydrogen, natural gas,tidal currents, hydro electric dams(adding turbines to existing dams) in this country? Think of how much power we could have if we put wind mils on the oceans? Just about 10 miles out so you couldn't see them! You wouldn't know if they were there or not. Yes it would cost more at first, but it would last forever if serviced (not hit by hurricanes)

 

I agree with the wind turbines, they were going to put a bunch off the west coast of MI, about 10 miles out.
There is actually a Facebook page about "no mistake in the lake", its totally stupid.
They have no actual claim as to why they should not put wind turbines in Lake Michigan, but they will not say that their real reason is because they are afraid they will see them from their multi million dollar homes as they watch the sun set.