Posers Driving Land Rovers
#21
08-11-2018, 07:49 AM
Baja
For the record, Im quite happy in my 1999 D2 with my 4.0 liter V8. You must realize this engine was not built for power. Everything from the 2000s were about nothing more than horsepower and it is now. Everyone wants to put their foot in it and instant gratification. I won't be surprised one bit when all these direct injected 4 cylinder turbocharged 300 horsepower aluminum lawn mower turds blow up, while i'm chugging along in my slow but simple v8 right past them on the freeway. I don't understand why people are always assuming newer is better. Id rather throw a head gasket or two on then replace a whole damn engine. The Rover V8 was built for simplicity, and durability to a certain extent. The failure 9 out of 10 of the time is due to owner negligence, not due to mechanical instability. Vehicles must be maintained, now sure, we can say some are more tolerant of abuse, like a Honda or Toyota, but those were built with budget in mind, so were overbuilt as a result. Let's be honest, the Discovery 1 and 2s are really budget, range rovers with a high roof and alpine windows, even these weren't meant for what defenders or series 1's from back in the day could do. These trucks in my opinion were meant for comfort and flexibility with bad weather in mind. These are luxury vehicles meant to be maintained. I've never heard of a defender with air suspension. Have you?
#22
08-11-2018, 08:13 AM
Super Moderator
#24
08-11-2018, 09:43 AM
Recovery Vehicle
it's not Defender money, but someone in Saint Louis is asking $10,500 for a 2003 Discovery 2. with the SES on and cat codes, a chipped windshield, tear in the back of the seat and a window regulator that doesn't work. while i don't see them getting what they are asking, the fact that they think they can get anything close to that much money is surprising.
https://stlouis.craigslist.org/cto/d...653986241.html
https://stlouis.craigslist.org/cto/d...653986241.html
#25
08-11-2018, 09:45 AM
TReK
They are becoming rare and people are willing to pay for a good one
I was just offered 8500 cdn for my 03 and was going to sell but I couldn't, turned down 2 buyers
heck called the landrover dealer asking for a oil separator and it pcv Guy had no idea
told me these are now classic vehicles and we don't carry and it stock parts lol
really
I was just offered 8500 cdn for my 03 and was going to sell but I couldn't, turned down 2 buyers
heck called the landrover dealer asking for a oil separator and it pcv Guy had no idea
told me these are now classic vehicles and we don't carry and it stock parts lol
really
#26
08-11-2018, 11:50 AM
Doesn’t matter if you consider the Kalahari a trim level vs a model. The fact remains only 150 were “ever” made in yellow. The Safarigard rockers extremely rare, the grill, the seats, and the wheels where limited production as well, sorry it’s more rare than the # of D90’s brought to America.
Also if you can’t fix/diagnose the silly and not that big of deal 3 Amigo’s then a LR probably isn’t for you. ...Friends 03 had a driveshaft kill the transmission, TC, exhaust, and the fuel lines. After replacing the broken parts, and a CPS it fired right up. An abandoned D2 can be fixed and brought back from the dead if you know what you’re doing.
I’ve owned to many vehicles that at the time were nothing special & now they’re all known as collectible classics. From my 2DR 87 Dodge Raider/Montero, my 97 RR 4.6L Vitesse in AA yellow (totally unique & rare parts only to that model of 150 yellow for 97), and my 05 Jeep Wrangler LJ. Nothing special at the time & now they’re sought after 4x4’s.
Now you are with me! Numbers alone is exactly my point. NAS Defenders are by in large valuable because they are an entirely DIFFERENT model sold in limited numbers.
I love LR’s from 1948 to 2009 would be my range, but I personally specialize in RRC/D1/D2’s and of coarse I do all the work on my 06 LR3. My passion has always been with the poor man’s RR AKA the Discovery. Ever since it’s US 1994 debut with the La Ruta Maya Adventure, and all the Camel Trophies that followed. I love it’s classic roof line, it’s old english V8 (hate it all you like it’s still got a special place in british history as it was used in just about anything British). The D2 was the final revison of the poor man’s RR, and yes the solid axles do make it unique vs what is offered today. Only Jeep is still sporting Solid axles as far as I know.
Discovery 5 door model Debuted at 1991 event at Tanzania Burundi, and continued in 1992, 1993, 1994, 1995, 1996, 1997, 1998.
^
Edit: I see you said US debut, forgot that was the year they brought them in.
Discovery 2 never did Camel Trophy.
Discovery 2 and Discovery 1 have different drive trains.
Discovery 2 has a longer body and worse departure angle.
Discovery 1 did Camel Trophy well because they were literally miniature defenders with manual transmissions and mechanical diesels.
You don’t honestly need to run the 180F thermostat. 2008-2010 is around the time people found out you “could” run one to help lower temps, but before that we all had 195F thermostats and somehow some of us are still driving on the original engine..... Like the facebook guy says and I quote you don’t have to run a 180F thermostat “but it helps.....”
The 3 Amigo’s are all over Forums these days and it’s honestly silly to me. People have dragged such a simple problem into the ground. Perform Option B, maybe repair some ABS sensor connectors, or replace them and be done with it! I own 4 D2’s that run and drive and my dash DOES NOT look like a RRC or a Christmas tree. It’s not rocket science and people are WAY overthinking it. It does however sometimes work in your favor when the seller drops the price thinking it's a $$$$ repair when all you need is a 3.00 wiring harness from Oreilly's and 30min of your time to fix (unless it's sensor related, however still cheap).
Dealer wise it was a HUGE disappointment. When I asked if they had any hats they pointed me to a Golf visor.... They also had way more Jaguar stuff vs “LR Gear” under that sign they had a coffee cup, and a LR pen... oh and a key ring. Not one ball cap, LR Shirt or anything unique. I’m sure it was the Dealership, but I’ll stick to Ebay for LR Gear lol
They have a rather large glass window looking into the service bay & it was all Disco Sports, RR, and Jag’s. They “might” have had an oldtimer there, but most old LR Master Tech’s I know have all gone independent. Not arguing at all, but the D1/D2 will be classic 4x4's.
They have a rather large glass window looking into the service bay & it was all Disco Sports, RR, and Jag’s. They “might” have had an oldtimer there, but most old LR Master Tech’s I know have all gone independent. Not arguing at all, but the D1/D2 will be classic 4x4's.
I still have not seen reasoning for why the D2 would ever approach NAS defender prices however. I still like D2.
Last edited by DavC; 08-11-2018 at 11:56 AM.
#28
08-11-2018, 11:53 AM
Recovery Vehicle
They are becoming rare and people are willing to pay for a good one
I was just offered 8500 cdn for my 03 and was going to sell but I couldn't, turned down 2 buyers
heck called the landrover dealer asking for a oil separator and it pcv Guy had no idea
told me these are now classic vehicles and we don't carry and it stock parts lol
really
I was just offered 8500 cdn for my 03 and was going to sell but I couldn't, turned down 2 buyers
heck called the landrover dealer asking for a oil separator and it pcv Guy had no idea
told me these are now classic vehicles and we don't carry and it stock parts lol
really
There's a whole segment of ownership that is driving Disco 2s until they drop. Those owners are always going to be in the cheapest moving transportation possible. They can't afford repairs. No maintenance is being done. When their ride stops, it gets sold to the scrap yard or impounded on the side of the road and towed.
The flip side is that these are enormously practical vehicles. If you are a rich guy with some land, having a good, running Disco 2 out on your ranch full time makes a *lot* of sense because it can go everywhere, take huge abuse, yet deliver a luxurious ride.
So there's a market for restored Disco 2s.
Two different ends of the market spectrum are driving these vehicles.
Just like neighborhoods have Gentrification, so do cars. Or in this case: trucks.
One group has them but can't afford them (this thread). The other group wants them already restored and is willing to pay.
#29
08-11-2018, 11:54 AM
This is something they are totally guilty of lol. If he said classic maybe he's right an I am wrong.
#30
08-11-2018, 12:48 PM
Super Moderator
You keep mentioning the European market & honestly here in the US that means nothing. Two totally different markets with different setups. I never said a single thing about a D2 ever being worth as much as a D90/110............ Dunno where you got that. All I've said in this entire thread is the D2 will be a classic LR & that's it and special editions produced in very limited numbers like the LE, Westminster, Kalahari, Trek, and G4 will be the $$$$$ of the bunch. I also never mentioned a D2 being in the Camel Trophy, I said I liked the Camel Trophy.
IMHO any 94-97 US market D90 or even a 93 110 are WAY overpriced, and why would I ever want one when I can have a RRC/D1/D2 for much less, not counting the cheaper insurance, and I don't have to worry about it being gone when I walk out of a store to drive it.... or at least just yet.
The 3 Amigo's is so 2010... Anyone that knows anything about LR's will honestly laugh if you make a big deal out of it today in 2018. It's no longer a HUGE secret on accessing the fault codes, or fixing it. Now yes back in maybe 99-06 it was a big deal and the only systems setup to diagnose them properly were at the dealership. That is no longer the case as you can grab a 100.00 scantool that can read the ABS fault codes, 50.00 ABS sensors vs the entire hub assembly. CPS is a sensor held in place by 2 lock nuts. Takes 15min to replace and they don't die like everyday. The original maybe gave you 10+ years of service, slap in a new Bosch unit and be done with it.
LS swap I am talking D90 import's with worn out and tired old 2.5L's. Also yes if my Bosch V8 decides to die I would consider an LS swap if I couldn't repair my Bosch V8. Reason I like an LS has nothing to do with it being superior to our Bosch V8's. It has to do with them being extremely common, tons of aftermarket support, and they can be had for a dime a dozen. I have owned 18 Buick 215 based LR's from 94 to 2004. All of them never blew up or threw a rod out the side, so in my "personal" experience and maintaining the Rover V8 I've had an excellent track record with them and since I live in TX I'm not one of those people with a nearly 20 year old car with maybe 65k on it.
The farmers around here are far from the old guys on an old Ford Tractor with a piece of straw in between their teeth. Have you looked at a Modern day tractor? It makes a D2 look like the old Ford tractor from the 50's! If they can fix a nearly 120K tractor I'm pretty sure a D2 is the least of their problems. Heck Jeremy, Richard, and James couldn't barely even drive one & they've all driven some of the most technology advanced supercars in the world.
Dealer wise I've stopped by 3 in TX Austin, Dallas, and Houston. They are all pushing the Jag's and LR's to techie BMW type people. The oldest dude I saw in the one yesterday was maybe 25-30. "If" I had asked them about anything older than 2005 I'm sure they'd have freaked out. Independent LR shops are where the 87-04 LR Master Tech's have gone around here. Two of my best friends run a shop near Austin, TX and they restore import D90/110/130's with LS swaps, Puma Dashes, and modern technology. They also love the RRC/D1/D2's. If you want true older LR knowledge trust me independent shops are the way to go.
IMHO any 94-97 US market D90 or even a 93 110 are WAY overpriced, and why would I ever want one when I can have a RRC/D1/D2 for much less, not counting the cheaper insurance, and I don't have to worry about it being gone when I walk out of a store to drive it.... or at least just yet.
The 3 Amigo's is so 2010... Anyone that knows anything about LR's will honestly laugh if you make a big deal out of it today in 2018. It's no longer a HUGE secret on accessing the fault codes, or fixing it. Now yes back in maybe 99-06 it was a big deal and the only systems setup to diagnose them properly were at the dealership. That is no longer the case as you can grab a 100.00 scantool that can read the ABS fault codes, 50.00 ABS sensors vs the entire hub assembly. CPS is a sensor held in place by 2 lock nuts. Takes 15min to replace and they don't die like everyday. The original maybe gave you 10+ years of service, slap in a new Bosch unit and be done with it.
LS swap I am talking D90 import's with worn out and tired old 2.5L's. Also yes if my Bosch V8 decides to die I would consider an LS swap if I couldn't repair my Bosch V8. Reason I like an LS has nothing to do with it being superior to our Bosch V8's. It has to do with them being extremely common, tons of aftermarket support, and they can be had for a dime a dozen. I have owned 18 Buick 215 based LR's from 94 to 2004. All of them never blew up or threw a rod out the side, so in my "personal" experience and maintaining the Rover V8 I've had an excellent track record with them and since I live in TX I'm not one of those people with a nearly 20 year old car with maybe 65k on it.
The farmers around here are far from the old guys on an old Ford Tractor with a piece of straw in between their teeth. Have you looked at a Modern day tractor? It makes a D2 look like the old Ford tractor from the 50's! If they can fix a nearly 120K tractor I'm pretty sure a D2 is the least of their problems. Heck Jeremy, Richard, and James couldn't barely even drive one & they've all driven some of the most technology advanced supercars in the world.
Dealer wise I've stopped by 3 in TX Austin, Dallas, and Houston. They are all pushing the Jag's and LR's to techie BMW type people. The oldest dude I saw in the one yesterday was maybe 25-30. "If" I had asked them about anything older than 2005 I'm sure they'd have freaked out. Independent LR shops are where the 87-04 LR Master Tech's have gone around here. Two of my best friends run a shop near Austin, TX and they restore import D90/110/130's with LS swaps, Puma Dashes, and modern technology. They also love the RRC/D1/D2's. If you want true older LR knowledge trust me independent shops are the way to go.