Just like in 2022, everyone was there but I didn't see a single Defender at the exhibition. Seems like Grenadier is beating it hands down as far as the presence and network effect is concerned - not only were there probably over 20 different Grenadiers all over advertising third party accessories, but the new local Grenadier dealer showed up in force with half a dozen vehicles of different trims and was busy handling those interested.

Crying shame.

 

Agree. It's very disappointing and a real shame the brand doesn't represent itself at these events. They've become a bit of a joke in the off-road community with they way they've neutered their lineup.
No market for 22" rims and spoiler kits at these events I suppose.

I was at a similar event here in the Puget Sound area last year. Three LR dealerships in the area and I had the only LR vehicle there.

Toyota, Jeep, Ford, and even Ineos all well represented. Tons of aftermarket stuff, all being tweaked and tailored to meet the fitment needs of these brands.
Loads of interest around the Grenadiers and other cool builds.

Land Rover seem to view these events with scorn or they simply have no interest in the world of camping and off-roading anymore. They only seem to show up to exclusively LR events where their echo chamber of ideas remains undisturbed. Folks get to hangout and play in muddy fields on low-profile tires of cheese while the latest racecar Defender gets promoted.

No wonder the aftermarket items remain niche and more expensive for the Defender. It needs to be two way street.

ARB for example, seem to want nothing to do with LR.

 

You have to understand that the purpose of these events is to showcase all the "new things".... The defender is now 5 years old and while it still looks and performs great, its old hat at this point.

The overland aftermarket is essentially creating Legos for adults. For the most part it consists of parts that can be easily bolted on to your rig in a weekend in the driveway using nothing but a toolkit you buy at home depot. It's a way for people to customize their rides and "make them theirs". The problem with the Defender - and this is something that is evident in just watching Powerfuluk's videos on installing something like recovery points - is that *nothing is simple* on the L663. With the exception of perhaps lift rods and settings in the GAP tool - if you actually want to do something like put rock sliders on or put an aftermarket rack on the roof - you're looking at an endeavor that is much more involved than it would be if it was on a 4Runner.

Then there's also the volume issue. Aftermarket parts suppliers want to sell as many copies of their product to as many customers as they can. The R&D on these items costs the same regardless of what vehicle they're for - but the fact that there are geometrically more Jeeps and Toyotas on the road than Defenders gives the aftermarket suppliers pause when deciding how much time and money to sink into new products... we face the same thing in the H1 community (only about 6k total left on the road now - very small customer base). The Grenadier is a product that is custom-made for the overland group and its no surprise that its well-represented.

There is a chance that after the L663's on the road get out of warranty and depreciate further, and prove to the world that they aren't unreliable - they will end up in the "$25k 3rd car toy" market segment where people will be able to afford to buy them and treat them like a consumable offroad vehicle. I think we're still a few years from that though. When/if that happens, I think you'll find the aftermarket willing to invest more in developing and showing off their wares.

Keep the faith! There's always the "DIY" approach to overland accessory building - design and build your own accessories:

 

That's the main reason I'm here with this vehicle in tow - if not for this community, I'd have written Defender off as a non-starter.

Also,

The chicken comes to the piglet and says:
- Dude, I have a smashing business idea! Let's open a "Ham and Eggs Breakfast Diner"!
- Nah, wait, not so fast, I have to think about it.
- What's there to think about? The profit's gonna be immense!
- You see, there's a difference. You're involved, I'm committed.

Same here No regrets. It was a calculated choice. (cue the joke about how good I am at math, and then about the guy who decided to get married)

 

Maybe I’m wrong but I tend to equate the Defender with Apple’s strategy and jeep’s, etc much more like google. Apple fully controls their platform marketing that closed ecosystem as an advantage. Google is a bring your own toy - which might work - and play market.

Defender is very very good right out of the box. For areas of deficiency, there are solutions, but they tend to be few in number and expensive - but, high quality and fully integrated.

You can get anything for a Jeep. Some good, some bad, you roll your own adventure.

all that is to say I don’t think Defender strategy is the same as Jeep and if what you want is full customization, Defender probably isn’t going to be the best choice for you. It’s a high quality closed system.

 

A plane is in the air. There's this one passenger, nervous, sweating bullets, cringing and clutching the armrests upon slightest sound and attitude change. His neighbor is eventually fed up:
- Relax, will you?!?! They're pilots, they know what they're doing!
- Shut up, will you?!?! I'm also a pilot, I know *exactly* what they're doing!

That is to say, I see the point of your analogy, but having spent a lot of time in those ecosystems, I gotta say that Google's control is even stricter and is more insidious than Apple's. I deeply resent both of them, for different reasons. But for the sake of the argument, all right.

This very thought crossed my mind already. One of the reasons I eventually landed with a Defender is that I've had a Jeep for five years and had gigantic plans to upgrade it, but never had time to actually get to it - but on the other hand, Defender has all that out of the box (at least theoretically). To name a few, roof rack, wheel cameras (integrated with everything else to boot), and a stock raised air intake (which I ended up not getting because of a recall, but that's a lesser deal than the others). Not to mention acceptable HVAC and sound insulation.

Granted, Jeep had decent wheels and rock sliders out of the box - and I had to buy them separately, and at 1600+ miles on the clock they're still not installed but taking space in my garage, for the same reason Jeep didn't get many upgrades - lack of time.

I'm not qualified to have an opinion here, haven't seen any in person (other than what I bought).

I'd say this is true for any advanced... not hobby, not pastime, but probably endeavor. Case in point, in RC flight the only things you can *buy* are entry level, and if you want to get anything any good, you have no choice other than to build - and here, the same factors come into play - time, budget, and expertise. No amount of money will save you if you don't know what you're doing.

Thankfully, manufacturing becomes progressively easier and cheaper these days. 3D printed parts are often strong enough to withstand the load (case in point, cup holder panel in one of the Grenadier trims that I saw at the expo is fully 3D printed - and that's just one part I saw glancing at it briefly), CNCs capable of handling aluminum are within reach, steel is a bit more problematic but not impossible. Different people go different ways - some prefer to pay, I prefer to build.

The main reason I got disappointed with no Defender presence at the Expo is that seeing something in the real world is priceless - pictures do not convey neither fine design points nor actual quality, even without Photoshop. Nothing on Internet can be trusted. But I guess there's no option other than to say "oh well" and keep moving. Like you said, it's a good rig from the get go.