I agree the ND can go anywhere - even on the 19" rims. Personally, looking back at the frustrations to my existing LR, a noticeable "weak point" has been the tires. I look at the Firestone and Kevlar reinforced tires on Jeeps, and I'm like "I want that!" It sounds silly, but I've had friends that end up with flats after hitting a pothole. How lame is that? Spend an extra few hundred bucks and put some rubber on there that won't puncture easily. It's not just the divot, there can be glass on the road too. Add it up, and I want large sidewalls with protection from curbs, glass, and other road hazards. It's not an academic requirement, it's just me trying to be practical after having several flats on my 18" rims with reasonable (not not spectacular) sidewalls. The larger sidewalls do make a difference - and the smaller rims would allow for a greater choice in tires. Some of the more expensive and durable tires seem to be paired with SUVs with 17" or 18" rims and large wheel arches. The ND, not having either of those, may be taking some tire options off the table for the owner. The GX shows that all the tires options can stay on the table, even for an off road ready family SUV. I've been to "restricted tire" showcase with my existing LR, and I'd like to ensure I have alot of tire options on my next one. It's not that the 19" can't go someplace the GX can go. As long as you're careful, it's all good. But the GX may allow more durable tires at the outset, meaning less likely to puncture or deflate after hitting something. JLR goes off the deep end with their academic discussions about how good a RR is off road. After repair bills, who would ever do that twice? I've never seen a RR park where I do. That's the point: even if a RR can do everything off road, one nudge to an unfriendly rock and you have a bill and possibly a flat. How inconvenient is that, just to have bragging rights big rims? JLR marketing says "off road," but the tire options say "highway and parking lot." That's the point GX is marketing to. GX is not trying to be better, it's giving choices: if you want a GX with big rims, great. But if you want the 18" rims, they will sell that too. A ND with 21" rims is an oxymoron - I don't get it & I'd never buy one. And now ND can't even have solid roofs?! I park my LR under pine trees - why would I want a glass roof? I don't, but ND has a mandatory glass roof. The GX allows choice. The metal roof is not better, but the GX offering it means they offer choices. Just like with rims. ND has been creeping upscale like G Wagons, and to some degree, if they go too far, they will lose folks that want to do stuff (and not care) with the SUV. If I have to be all nice & careful with it, I won't buy it. That has been the beauty of my existing LR - it has done well, a few dents along the way. If JLR wanted to compete, clearly it could. A Yukon AT4 is a family ready SUV for an adventure - yet the rims are likely 20". What they did was give a huge wheel arch and suspension, to allow for a good sidewall. I'm not saying it can go where Rubicon goes, but the effort from Yukon is there: if you go off road in it - trail or whatever - your problem won't be the tires. I think JLR is too focused on the on road handling, and that's given the GX some room to compete. JLR is going upscale, and I do get it. The OD image that they used initially to launch ND in 2020 had a shelf-life: OD nostalgia won't sell many NDs after you see a Grenadier. The Grenadier looks to be the capable SUV you can take off road or whack with a hammer - it will make little difference to a steel box. Whatever population JLR was marketing to with OD nostalgia, it's going to fall on deaf ears once folks - if they really wanted a modern production OD - park next to a Grenadier and think to themselves "wtf is that!" I saw one for the first time today, just parked in a driveway. It's doesn't say "I know you stare at me!" as RR or ND will do. It's not bling. It's more like, "yea Rubicon, I got what you got, but I have more - I have a solid roof. I may even be comfortable inside!?" Woa...

 

I'm confused - did JLR discontinue the 18" wheel option for the P300 Defender? Did they also discontinue solid roofs?

I'm currently driving my 2022 P300 110 with 18" steel wheels and 70 section sidewalls (and no sunroof because I have the expedition rack) - total wheel / tire diameter is 32.4". Do you need bigger tires or taller sidewalls than that?

The obsession with putting tractor tires on vehicles seems to be confined to North America and I'm not sure what the purpose is beyond mud bogging or looking good outside bars

 

[QUOTE=DoctorofRocks;880369]I'm confused - did JLR discontinue the 18" wheel option for the P300 Defender? Did they also discontinue solid roofs?

I'm currently driving my 2022 P300 110 with 18" steel wheels and 70 section sidewalls (and no sunroof because I have the expedition rack) - total wheel / tire diameter is 32.4". Do you need bigger tires or taller sidewalls than that?

You have a great set-up, but I balked at the engine: I wanted to hold out for the 6 cyl. instead of the 4 cyl. I drive with family + luggage, and I already have a 2L LR engine - it's great with few, but it struggled loaded. By waiting, it's now the case that JLR will no longer sell solid roof Defenders in the US. They did initially, which is how you have yours configured! As for tires, I was looking at one by BF Goodrich - All Terrain KO2. Can you put those on ND? There's another Goodyear with Kevlar. Don't think "extreme off roading," think "crazy durable." Goodyear sells these tires to larger rims, but I think that would just reduce the sidewall. It's not the rim size I care about so much, as the protection a larger sidewall will offer (from flats). Jeeps have the luxury of parking pretty much wherever your stop the Wrangler. But my LR doesn't have the same tire protection- and parking it against a sharp rock or curb is not a good idea. I have to be careful not to hit curbs! Some of the Wranglers I've seen over the years really don't care what's below the tire, and so the KO2s seem worthy of a shot.

 

I feel like 300hp is plenty. I travelled all over the western US in an 80hp Toyota 4x4 truck and regularly drove a series 2b 109 with eight people and a 67hp engine.

Personally, I think the hp wars are crazy - not long ago 250-300hp would have been the power output from a $100,000 European sports car, and now its the base engine option on an SUV. But then again I don't cruise at 80 with a full load, so other people's needs / wants are different.

I can say that I have never wanted more power in the two years that I have owned the vehicle and I like that the engine is (somewhat) simpler and more tested than the MHEV 6 cylinder, plus I have more space under the floor in the rear.

I've always liked the KO2s but the weight of them is the killer for me - they are over 50lbs each which is a big difference from the stock tires. I've heard good things about the Falken Wildpeaks, but their load rating is too low for the Defender. When it comes time for new tires I'm not sure what I will do but I'm pretty sure I don't want an extra 20% unsprung weight on each corner and on the back door.

 

I totally agree about the HP myopia. There's a few reasons I'm avoiding EVs right now, but one is that the manufacturers are really trying to sell the 0-60 speeds - but for me that's not a selling point. I'd rather a smaller battery and a bit slower on the acceleration - maybe the battery would last longer? I don't care if the SUV can do 120 mph or 180 mph - my highway cruise is 80 mph and under. Folks complain about battery life, but why manufacture a big SUV or truck that does 0-60 in 3 seconds and can easily hit 100 mph? I think Toyota nailed it with the hybrids, and the Defender 110 with a "mild hybrid" is also a great way to have a battery improve mpg and the torque, without having to lug 1,000+ lbs of battery on the floor.

 

To the bolded point, I have an EV truck, and needless to say how fast you choose to accelerate - and consume energy - is entirely up to you.

And at close to $6 per gallon here, the truck is much cheaper to operate than my Defender. Cheaper to insure too.

 

Actually, no. Batteries age due to 2 factors: cycles and time. Time we can't do anything about (yet :-p). But the smaller the battery, the more often it is cycled (=discharged and recharged to the amount of the battery's full capacity). So bigger = better. Here too.

 

Im finally catching up on this thread. Others have addressed some of these, but I have a 2023.5 110S P300 with coil springs, 18” wheels and a solid roof. I understand the solid roof may be gone from the option list, but the rest of it is still there.

I’ve had it for a year. Made several long trips with a car full of gear, family and a large dog. The engine is more than adequate. As someone else mentioned, there was a day when 300hp was an extraordinary amount of power.

I’ve off-roaded it several times (on aired down stock GY Adventures!) and kept up with Rubicons over truly challenging terrain.

If the new LC/GX models had been out two years ago when I placed my order I certainly would have cross-shopped. But I may still have ended up with my Defender. It’s too early for real reviews of the Toyotas. But more competition in the space is a good thing.

 

https://www.texaspolicy.com/wp-conte...nnettIsaac.pdf

90% of the electricity in the USA is coal powered... EV's are the opposite of what the public has been conditioned to embrace as their virtue. It is not a green technology. The batteries... don't get me started on those. Where does the cobalt come from, who is mining it, and under what conditions?

 

Sir. This is an Arby's