Need Engine Help
#41
01-10-2014, 12:28 PM
#42
01-10-2014, 12:59 PM
All of the misfires and problems you were having more then likely totaled your cats. Your O2 codes are probably pointing you to that problem. Sorry, but you will more then likely not be able to fix them by cleaning and need new ones. From page 244 of the RAVE:
The basic control loop comprises the engine (controlled system), the heated oxygen sensors (measuring elements),
the engine management ECM (control) and the injectors and ignition (actuators). Other factors also influence the
calculations of the ECM, such as air flow, air intake temperature and throttle position. Additionally, special driving
conditions are compensated for, such as starting, acceleration, deceleration, overrun and full load.
The reliability of the ignition system is critical for efficient catalytic converter operation, since misfiring will lead to
irreparable damage of the catalytic converter due to the overheating that occurs when unburned combustion gases
are burnt inside it.
CAUTION: If the engine is misfiring, it should be shut down immediately and the cause rectified. Failure to do
so will result in irreparable damage to the catalytic converter.
CAUTION: Ensure the exhaust system is free from leaks. Exhaust gas leaks upstream of the catalytic
converter could cause internal damage to the catalytic converter.
CAUTION: Serious damage to the engine may occur if a lower octane number fuel than recommended is used.
Serious damage to the catalytic converter and oxygen sensors will occur if leaded fuel is used.
The basic control loop comprises the engine (controlled system), the heated oxygen sensors (measuring elements),
the engine management ECM (control) and the injectors and ignition (actuators). Other factors also influence the
calculations of the ECM, such as air flow, air intake temperature and throttle position. Additionally, special driving
conditions are compensated for, such as starting, acceleration, deceleration, overrun and full load.
The reliability of the ignition system is critical for efficient catalytic converter operation, since misfiring will lead to
irreparable damage of the catalytic converter due to the overheating that occurs when unburned combustion gases
are burnt inside it.
CAUTION: If the engine is misfiring, it should be shut down immediately and the cause rectified. Failure to do
so will result in irreparable damage to the catalytic converter.
CAUTION: Ensure the exhaust system is free from leaks. Exhaust gas leaks upstream of the catalytic
converter could cause internal damage to the catalytic converter.
CAUTION: Serious damage to the engine may occur if a lower octane number fuel than recommended is used.
Serious damage to the catalytic converter and oxygen sensors will occur if leaded fuel is used.
Last edited by Jared9220; 01-10-2014 at 01:01 PM.
#43
01-10-2014, 03:05 PM
I finally figured out how to copy and save certain pages from the RAVE and post them. This may help diagnose the bad cats.
cat info.pdf
And it's a little late but I just found this Injector test light on atlanticBritish. I think I'm going to order one next time I need parts.
http://www.roverparts.com/Parts/W121.cfm
Last edited by Jared9220; 01-10-2014 at 04:21 PM.
#45
01-11-2014, 12:09 PM
I used OEM and bought as a complete set (4). They have the connectors on them.
Last edited by Charlie_V; 01-11-2014 at 01:08 PM.
#46
01-11-2014, 01:10 PM
All of the misfires and problems you were having more then likely totaled your cats. Your O2 codes are probably pointing you to that problem. Sorry, but you will more then likely not be able to fix them by cleaning and need new ones. From page 244 of the RAVE:
The basic control loop comprises the engine (controlled system), the heated oxygen sensors (measuring elements),
the engine management ECM (control) and the injectors and ignition (actuators). Other factors also influence the
calculations of the ECM, such as air flow, air intake temperature and throttle position. Additionally, special driving
conditions are compensated for, such as starting, acceleration, deceleration, overrun and full load.
The reliability of the ignition system is critical for efficient catalytic converter operation, since misfiring will lead to
irreparable damage of the catalytic converter due to the overheating that occurs when unburned combustion gases
are burnt inside it.
CAUTION: If the engine is misfiring, it should be shut down immediately and the cause rectified. Failure to do
so will result in irreparable damage to the catalytic converter.
CAUTION: Ensure the exhaust system is free from leaks. Exhaust gas leaks upstream of the catalytic
converter could cause internal damage to the catalytic converter.
CAUTION: Serious damage to the engine may occur if a lower octane number fuel than recommended is used.
Serious damage to the catalytic converter and oxygen sensors will occur if leaded fuel is used.
The basic control loop comprises the engine (controlled system), the heated oxygen sensors (measuring elements),
the engine management ECM (control) and the injectors and ignition (actuators). Other factors also influence the
calculations of the ECM, such as air flow, air intake temperature and throttle position. Additionally, special driving
conditions are compensated for, such as starting, acceleration, deceleration, overrun and full load.
The reliability of the ignition system is critical for efficient catalytic converter operation, since misfiring will lead to
irreparable damage of the catalytic converter due to the overheating that occurs when unburned combustion gases
are burnt inside it.
CAUTION: If the engine is misfiring, it should be shut down immediately and the cause rectified. Failure to do
so will result in irreparable damage to the catalytic converter.
CAUTION: Ensure the exhaust system is free from leaks. Exhaust gas leaks upstream of the catalytic
converter could cause internal damage to the catalytic converter.
CAUTION: Serious damage to the engine may occur if a lower octane number fuel than recommended is used.
Serious damage to the catalytic converter and oxygen sensors will occur if leaded fuel is used.
The passenger cat has an offset from the front to the back pipe. Ugh. Not an easy setup.
Last edited by Charlie_V; 01-11-2014 at 09:38 PM.
#48
01-11-2014, 09:38 PM
#49
01-13-2014, 01:47 AM
My Rover has gremlins.
After getting everything together early Friday morning, I drove 35 miles with nary a code at 70mph. After two hours in a dry parking lot, I started it back up and ten miles into the return trip it stuttered so badly I had to stop. The from O2 sensors and their heaters were out, and I had misfires on 1 3 5 and 7. As you might imagine the rest of the trip occurred at between 5 and 10mph.
Returned home, I checked and cleaned the one week old Bosch oxygen sensor connections with wd40. I heard a loud rattling under the truck that is loudest at the driver side catalytic converter.
Then I had to leave town to drive 5 hours with a travel trailer in tow to help my wife with a trade show. Returning last night at 10, I immediately put on overalls and pulled the front oxygen sensors.
I tried starting the truck with oxygen sensors out. No change. I still had the misfires on 1 3 5 and 7. It was so bad it won't even idle without a deft touch on the skinny pedal.
So I pulled the intake, swapped back to my original coils, and reassembled everything including the oxygen sensors.
Now the 1 3 5 and 7 misfires are gone and it idles fine, but I am still getting the front oxygen sensor codes (no heater, no sensor) on both banks. When I give it gas, it bogs down at about 3000rpm. The rattle is less.
I put a stethoscope on everything I could touch with the engine running and the loudest place is the driver side catalytic converter. I traced up to the individual cylinders (on the head and valve covers), and the loudest place by far is still the driver side catalytic converter. Now the misfires show at 4 and 8.
Could this be the wiring?? Is is possible that the problem keeps moving because I fiddle with the harness that runs along the back of the engine every time I change the HG, spark plug wires, coil, etc? Or do I have gremlins...
After getting everything together early Friday morning, I drove 35 miles with nary a code at 70mph. After two hours in a dry parking lot, I started it back up and ten miles into the return trip it stuttered so badly I had to stop. The from O2 sensors and their heaters were out, and I had misfires on 1 3 5 and 7. As you might imagine the rest of the trip occurred at between 5 and 10mph.
Returned home, I checked and cleaned the one week old Bosch oxygen sensor connections with wd40. I heard a loud rattling under the truck that is loudest at the driver side catalytic converter.
Then I had to leave town to drive 5 hours with a travel trailer in tow to help my wife with a trade show. Returning last night at 10, I immediately put on overalls and pulled the front oxygen sensors.
I tried starting the truck with oxygen sensors out. No change. I still had the misfires on 1 3 5 and 7. It was so bad it won't even idle without a deft touch on the skinny pedal.
So I pulled the intake, swapped back to my original coils, and reassembled everything including the oxygen sensors.
Now the 1 3 5 and 7 misfires are gone and it idles fine, but I am still getting the front oxygen sensor codes (no heater, no sensor) on both banks. When I give it gas, it bogs down at about 3000rpm. The rattle is less.
I put a stethoscope on everything I could touch with the engine running and the loudest place is the driver side catalytic converter. I traced up to the individual cylinders (on the head and valve covers), and the loudest place by far is still the driver side catalytic converter. Now the misfires show at 4 and 8.
Could this be the wiring?? Is is possible that the problem keeps moving because I fiddle with the harness that runs along the back of the engine every time I change the HG, spark plug wires, coil, etc? Or do I have gremlins...
#50
01-13-2014, 09:06 AM
Recovery Vehicle