My g/f has a 2003 Disco she bought used. Since day 1 it's had an engine knock that is pretty loud once the engine starts to warm up (doesn't need full warm-up). She took it to a dealer to get it fixed under warranty and they had to break it down and discovered the push rods were installed upside down. Would this cause a knocking? Would it cause any other collateral damage?

The Service Manager at the dealer said that it shouldn't make a difference, but I'm seeing otherwise on the internet forums. That you have to put them in correctly, but they don't say why (I'm assuming it'll cause a problem, but not sure what)

Thanks in advance for your help and suggestions!

 

Good thing it is under warranty. But wait until some of the pro techs and indy shop owners comment on this. I think pushrods last like forever, but you can't swap out lifters without the cam, etc.

 

Quote:
I think pushrods last like forever...

I don't think they do if they're in upside down.

 

They can wear down with time, but it doesn't matter which way they go in.
There is something else going on and I am surprised the shop mentioned such a stupid reason for the noise.

 

What the service manager actually said was that it didn't matter they were in upside down. But, they can't find the reason for the noise. I've been told there's tech bulletins regarding the oil pump for this year/model. Like it doesn't pump enough oil into the motor, so it rattles once the oil heats up and thins out a bit. Dunno. The knock is pretty bad. There's got to be something wrong, but not even the dealer can find it.

 

How long is the warranty good for?

 

When she bought 10/2011, it was a 3 year warranty. But, I want it fixed now. It's a safety issue at this point. I don't want her broken down in the middle of nowhere, ya know?

Anyone have any experience with this knocking? After doing some research, it's not uncommon with this series of Rover. Suggestions on what to look for?

 

The oil pumps can crack and make (or not make) a "ticking" sound. See pix. An oil PSI test with a mechanical gauge (when engine is all together and running) can show if enough PSI is being produced at various rpms. If engine is taken apart it is a cheap fix as parts kit is about $100. See Oil Pump Gear Kit W/Gaskets - Land Rover kits from Atlantic British But if run with low oil pressure long enough, damage could have been done to a variety of bearings. You said GF has been driving with this noise for over a year.

Knocking sounds are old school diagnosed by removing plug wires one by one to lessen the load on a cylinder, and sometimes noise changes or stops, pointing you toward the area. The careful inspection and measurements can be made. The lower end is usually the source of knocks. Lifters and valve train noise are usually referred to as a tapping sound. Here's a view of the lower end and how it can be rebuilt in the truck. https://landroverforums.com/forum/di...rite-up-48197/

Your point that it makes the noises as warming up, but not fully warmed up, may point to oil PSI problem. When cold, engine starts and the oil filter bypass valve (inside the filter) acivates, allowing the oil pump to make maximum pressure (normally idle and 2000 rpm oil PSI when cold are very close). As oil warms, the bypass valve closes, forcing oil thru the filter media. If filter quality or specific one is off normal, PSI can drop quite a bit. Oil pressure spec is 10 PSI at idle. Many see 20s. Oil light comes on around 7 PSI. Spec is 50 PSI at speed. See https://landroverforums.com/forum/di...estions-46975/. Don't know if they tested oil PSI before taking apart.

You are right to be concerned. But aside from GF being stranded, oil related failure will likely take the engine out. On a lighter note, there are a variety of reasons for ticks, including slipped cylinder liners, cracked flex plates, and my all time fave: tools left by previous mechanics....

 

Thanks for all the info, SB. My mechanic (that said he wouldn't work on it) printed out a tech bulletin from his diagnostic software that brought up the Oil Pump. I don't want the engine to go. She hasn't had it for a year, she got it in Oct. of 2011, so a little over 6 months, but I kept on her to get it looked at while under the extended warranty she bought at the time she got the vehicle. I understand that it could blow the engine, but given that it'd be covered under warranty my main concern is her breaking down in the middle of God-knows-where. She knows there's an issue, but as long as she can turn the key and it starts, she drives it. Grrrrr.

I'm going to talk to the Service Manager at the dealership she has it at this morning and bring up the oil pump. I had a bit of that information already, but now that I see it's a stronger possibility as to the issue, I'm going to bring it up to him if they hadn't checked it already. Especially now that I know what it *should* be at PSI-wise.

As for 'ticks', those I've heard on older cars I've owned. This is more a 'knock' that sounds like a hammer hitting the block. It's definitely not a lifter tap.

And your explanation of how the oil is released makes sense as to what/when I'm hearing it. We picked it up from getting the brakes and tires done one day and she started it up and we were talking about stuff for like maybe a minute. The engine was quiet and smooth. I noticed this and pointed it out, but as I was walking away it starting the knocking again out of nowhere and continued for the rest of the night. So, that may have been when the bypass valve closed. I'm sure it doesn't stay open for more than a minute or two once things get up to 'pressure'. She also said that when it's really cold outside the engine is a little quieter. The oil is a bit thicker, I guess?

Anyway, thanks again for everyone's help and input. Gives me some ammunition to use while I'm talking to them today. And, hopefully and ultimately, get it repaired and running right.


Thank you!

 

You are going in the wrong direction. There was a TSB for 03's within a certain vin range, if yours is one of them your tick is not because of that issue, if it were, the engine would have blown with in a day of the tick starting and at every stop light your oil pressure light would have come on.
If you want some help with this, PM me your address and I'll walk you thru what to do.