Evening All,

Earlier this week I finally swapped passenger and driver side front lower control arms. Made sure I had all new Nuts and Bolts, from Atlantic British. I found the actual control arms cheap on Amazon - Dorman, Warehouse Deals (but brand new), about $50 each and free shipping.

I also checked the other suspension pieces, and replaced an outer tie rod end and a sway bar link.

I intentionally took off the Brake Rotors, so that it was much easier to get the old arms off and the new arms on - less weight, so that I could easily 'angle' the bottom of the hub / spindle assembly up and out, with left hand, so that the ball joint of control arm could be inserted without any problems using right hand, and at the right place so that the strut could be easily slipped into the place.

My vehicle deals with midwest winters, has about 126,000 miles, and I believe the old control arms were the originals, so I was not surprised when both passenger and driver side 'rear' bushing bolts were seized in place - Needed to use Angle Grinder and Reciprocating Saw to cut through the control arm near to the bushing, and to cut through the bolt sleeves and bolts. This obviously took a long time, with lots of sparks, but not exactly difficult.

I took it slow, did lots of research beforehand, and was very pleased with how it all went. I am most surprised by the fact that I didn't have a single smacked knuckle!

Huge thanks to everybody who has ever provided advice on any of the forums or on youtube!

Now comes the interesting part - Tires Plus. Commerce Drive, Madison, Wisconsin. 2 miles from my house. I have the Lifetime Alignment.

Part 1 -

Obviously I needed to get a complete 4 wheel alignment done, so I booked the appointment about 5 days before I started the work, to give me enough time. This vehicle is sort of 'spare', I don't need to use it much, so no issues if it's sitting on jacks in the garage for a few days.

Anyway, I get a call from them - They say they cannot finish the alignment. Something about a stripped bolt or washer. Not making much sense on the phone, so I head down there.

They say that the driver side front bushing camber washer does not move, does not turn, when the bolt head is turned. Suggesting that the 2 'ears' of the cam washer have been shorn off. Nut was tightly attached to bolt, when I went down there to take a look, and they refused to undo it with me there, so I could not examine it when it was on the ramp. They said the bolt may fly out, i.e. 'safety' excuse. I took spare brand new nuts, bolts and washers with me, but they refuse to swap out the broken parts without charging me full install price.

There is no possible way that I did anything to damage the cam washer. But Tires Plus refused to agree that they may have done something wrong.

I drove the vehicle home, and took lots of video footage of the vehicle before and after removing the nut/washer/bolt, and sure enough, the 2 'ears' of the cam washer were completely gone. I also took video footage of me re-installing new Bolt and Washer.

My gut feeling is that they used a very powerful air-wrench on the bolt head, to loosen the bolt head from the nut, at full speed, full power, causing the bolt to very quickly turn and strip off the 2 ears. I honestly don't know how else this happened. Possible that there was a weak batch of cam washers I suppose, but if Tires Plus had used 'hand' tools, instead of 'power' tools, then I don't think there would have been the necessary 'force' to strip out the 2 'ears'. What do you think - Am I on the right track with this? Anybody else experienced stripped cam washers?

Part 2 -

Took the vehicle back down there. They are able to start working on it soon, so I made sure I spoke to the actual person who will be doing the work, and also got him to promise me that they won't use any power tools. I also went to see the actual alignment ramp to make sure it has the correct moving metal plates assembly, and I reminded him to refer to the info sheet that I produced and gave to them, which has all the torque specs and other useful info (keep driver door open to lock the air suspension, make sure distance from middle of axel nut to bottom of black plastic wheel arch fender is 18.34 inches before tightening camber bolts, etc).

I head across the road to a coffee shop, and tuck into a nice strong cappuccino and a sausage stuffed waffle.

Get a call from Tires Plus about an hour later. "Do you by any chance still have your keys on you?"

Yeah, some of you are probably laughing out loud and way ahead of me at this point, but let's continue...

So, the "Manager" who I had been dealing with, the same one who refused to admit that they may have damaged the cam washer, same person who refused to just swap out the damaged parts with the ones that I bought down to them, even when the vehicle was already on the ramp, thus forcing me to take it home and do it myself, the same Manager who was standing behind the service counter when I put the keys on the counter in front of him, has somehow managed to lose my keys.

I would say that 'managing' is not his greatest talent.

'Barely coping to walk and chew gum at the same time' is a better description than 'Managing' for this person, based upon my experience.

Fast forward a couple of hours, they still haven't found the keys, so it's time to assume that they never will find them, and take action.

I get them to admit that they have lost the keys, I tell them they will need to order and pay for a new key from the local Land Rover dealership, which they agree to, and I also tell them they will need to provide me with a free rental car, for the entire time that I am without my car. Which could be about 2 weeks. They also agree to this.

I Uber home, and call their head office customer service department, to start the formal complaint process.

This was yesterday, and someone arrived at my house this morning with a brand new Jeep Grand Cherokee.

We'll see if a Regional or District Manager calls me tomorrow morning, as requested when I spoke with customer service yesterday.

I will be requesting lots of money as compensation for the permanent emotional damage that I have sustained. Ha Ha. Don't worry, I'm totally ok - I just think this whole situation is yet another reason why I will always try to do the work myself, if I can.

Figured I would share - I'll probably update you all, as this exciting situation progresses.

Cheers, Simon

 

I believe my cam washers have issues, too...and my alignments have only ever been done at Land Rover dealers...not that that's instant validation of quality. Those guys over-torque my lugs consistently and they stripped out my oil pan plug over the years, too, causing me to re-engineer it.

Did you somehow come up with a solution to the cam washer situation? Can you even replace that? They gave me some song 'n dance about having to take it to a body shop and weld this or that and $$$. If there is an alternative, please advise.

Thanks,
Erek

 

Cam washers are a couple of bucks and can be changed when control arms are unbolted.

sounds like the tabs that the cam washers lock into are damaged and they want to re weld some tabs on your frame.

 

Not to hi-jack but how did you re-engineer it?

 

@abran yes that's exactly what they described. Is that a time-consuming operation? Expensive?

@ArmyRover I had an OEM drain plug tapped and then fit stainless steel fittings to it, thus relocating the drain hole. The plug was then JB Welded into the pan. It's never coming out again. the SS fittings include an elbow and a cap. Remove the cap, oil comes out. Simple....the one important thing is the 90 turn. That way torque applied in removing the cap doesn't also put a torque on the drain plug.

I have a photo somewhere...I'll try to post it.

Found it!

 

You might actually be brilliant

Now with that I just need to find a alternate way to pull my oil filter and I no longer have to remove my skid plate. Oh and I can quit living in fear of a junk drain plug....

 

It s small job, but just need a person that can weld and a lift.

They will need to remove the inboard bolts that attach the bushings, weld and reattach arms on bushing side. Should be the cost of doing the arms and maybe an hour more for welding.

Bummer is, I believe they are bad in the first place place because they did a ****ty job and torqued down the bolts while the Cam washer was not set inside the tabs.

 

Tire Plus is a horrible chain. I will never go back to one. With my Mark VIII they did an alignment and the front wheels were jammed far forward or back. I forget which. But it was obvious there was an issue before I even left and they had to re-do the alignment. Its computer done, how could they even mess that up? Way out of spec. Another incident involved near new BMW 7 series rims. They had factory tires on them for about 20,000 miles then the tires removed and sat stored. Then I decided to toss another tire set on them for install on another BMW. These are painted rims and they scratched them up BIG time. The ground down to the metal on the inside to remove old weights and whatever they did, I think balancing, messed up the faces particularly near the centers. I had to file a complaint but it when nowhere. I will never, ever go to one again. I already decide the Rover will go to a Rover dealer only for alignments.

And as for Dorman... I wont even get into the issues I had with their parts. Let just say I am back to using MOOG or OEM maker only.

 

You first lost me the second you allowed a chain company to touch your LR3. Your second loss was trying to extort them financially, as that is IMO not ethical.

 

@abran, sounds like I should wait until I need control arms, then have the tabs welded on.

@ArmyRover, I was really sweating the oil pan when I thought I'd have to replace it. The cost is astronomical. I was lamenting it to a co-worker and he was like "you don't have to do that" and started talking about marine solutions he'd seen and such...and then I remembered that I'm an Engineer! I went to work sourcing parts and finding a local machine shop to do the tapping. I made two of them for about $25. The machine shop wouldn't even take my money; I dropped a 6-pack of a good craft beer and it was all good.

I've had the oil changed since then. It works....a little slower but I don't care. Works best to change it HOT so that the oil will be less viscous and flow better through the smaller hole.