1313 - New Cats and O2's
TReK
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 2,073
Likes: 6
From: Ketchikan, Alaska, USA
Your 96 is non-eal. IIRC, non-ael has a fuel supply and return line at the fuel pump. I don't recall on the AEL. I think they have a third line to the pump. But I could be mistaken. Someone explained it to me long ago. I just took notice that I have the non-ael and the ael didn't start till 98 I think.
Baja
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 5,584
Likes: 7
From: Pittsburgh PA suburbs.
I crawled under mine and tapped the CATS with a hammer and no rattles, so I guess they may still be ok.
When I do rev it and let off I hear a bit of a rattle which made me wonder if that was the cats, but tapping with a hammer does not show a rattle.
I did notice that when I first crank it in the mornings, I get noticeable water vapor, but no sweet smell, no antifreeze, it will blow droplets of clear water if I rev it and dampen the driveway a few feet behind the car. Lots of black in the exhaust pipe from apparently running rich as if something is sensing a lean condition and forcing it rich, the only code that appears is 1316 and it is sporadic.
No indication of coolant in the oil or oil in the coolant. Does not overheat. Has awesome power. Runs like scalded dog.
If I take off it in first or second and keep the pressure on the accelerator, it winds up close to 4000 rpms and shifts when I let off. First gear alon will get me a speeding ticket, if I wind second up, I run out of road before I can wind third up unless I go way out from where I live or jump on the Interstate.
Cruises at 70-75 with no effort. Have to keep eye on speedo since it is running so powerfully.
When I do rev it and let off I hear a bit of a rattle which made me wonder if that was the cats, but tapping with a hammer does not show a rattle.
I did notice that when I first crank it in the mornings, I get noticeable water vapor, but no sweet smell, no antifreeze, it will blow droplets of clear water if I rev it and dampen the driveway a few feet behind the car. Lots of black in the exhaust pipe from apparently running rich as if something is sensing a lean condition and forcing it rich, the only code that appears is 1316 and it is sporadic.
No indication of coolant in the oil or oil in the coolant. Does not overheat. Has awesome power. Runs like scalded dog.
If I take off it in first or second and keep the pressure on the accelerator, it winds up close to 4000 rpms and shifts when I let off. First gear alon will get me a speeding ticket, if I wind second up, I run out of road before I can wind third up unless I go way out from where I live or jump on the Interstate.
Cruises at 70-75 with no effort. Have to keep eye on speedo since it is running so powerfully.
Baja
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 5,584
Likes: 7
From: Pittsburgh PA suburbs.
I think the transistion to AEL was mid 97 MY at some specific VIN Number. Fuel pump has two electrical connectors for AEL I think. Also has a square cannister instead of the round charcoal cannister.
Someone had indicated they blanked off that cannister line with caps and it cleard their 1316 codes.
According to the OBDII codes 1313 is Bank A (plugs 1,3,5,7) drivers side of engine and 1314 is bank B. But I would go ahead andchange both of those front O2's and go from there.
Maybe someone that specializes in selling new LR parts could make us all a group deal on the correct O2's since everal of us could probably use at least two new ones. HINT HINT!
Let's see if anyone comes thru for the group.
Someone had indicated they blanked off that cannister line with caps and it cleard their 1316 codes.
According to the OBDII codes 1313 is Bank A (plugs 1,3,5,7) drivers side of engine and 1314 is bank B. But I would go ahead andchange both of those front O2's and go from there.
Maybe someone that specializes in selling new LR parts could make us all a group deal on the correct O2's since everal of us could probably use at least two new ones. HINT HINT!
Let's see if anyone comes thru for the group.
Super Moderator
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 16,322
Likes: 88
From: Savannah Georgia
re: "max correction FMFR and AMFR" means and what that may relate to."
Fuel Mass Flow Rate and Air MAss Flow Rate
The ECU monitors and adapts to variations to keep the fuel air ratio ideal. When limits of adapatation are reach, you get the correct limit codes.
for inquiring minds - from GEMS manual
Danny can actually read these programs because he learnt Fortran IV back in the stone age.
Fuel Mass Flow Rate and Air MAss Flow Rate
The ECU monitors and adapts to variations to keep the fuel air ratio ideal. When limits of adapatation are reach, you get the correct limit codes.
for inquiring minds - from GEMS manual
Long Term Fuel Trim Diagnostics
These tests monitor the performance of the Adaptive Fuelling System. If the corrections it applies exceed limits, then the appropriate fault is present.
The fault remains until the system returns to within limits. The checks performed are detailed below.
If the ADAP_FMFR_CORR value is greater than FUEL_DIAG_MAX_POS_FMFR_CORR then a MAX_POSITIVE_FMFR_CORR_FAULT is present.
If the ADAP_FMFR_CORR value is less than FUEL_DIAG_MAX_NEG_FMFR_CORR then a MAX_NEG_FMFR_CORR_FAULT is present.
If the ADAP_AMFR_CORR value is greater than FUEL_DIAG_MAX_POS_AMFR_CORR then a MAX_POSITIVE_AMFR_CORR_FAULT is present.
If the ADAP_AMFR_CORR value is less than FUEL_DIAG_MAX_NEG_AMFR_CORR then a MAX_NEGATIVE_AMFR_CORR_FAULT is present.The fault remains until the system returns to within limits. The checks performed are detailed below.
If the ADAP_FMFR_CORR value is greater than FUEL_DIAG_MAX_POS_FMFR_CORR then a MAX_POSITIVE_FMFR_CORR_FAULT is present.
If the ADAP_FMFR_CORR value is less than FUEL_DIAG_MAX_NEG_FMFR_CORR then a MAX_NEG_FMFR_CORR_FAULT is present.
If the ADAP_AMFR_CORR value is greater than FUEL_DIAG_MAX_POS_AMFR_CORR then a MAX_POSITIVE_AMFR_CORR_FAULT is present.
Danny can actually read these programs because he learnt Fortran IV back in the stone age.
TReK
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 2,073
Likes: 6
From: Ketchikan, Alaska, USA
TReK
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 2,073
Likes: 6
From: Ketchikan, Alaska, USA
If you are not positive, but still want to replace them, start with the pre-cat O2 sensors. The post-cat O2 sensors do not affect fuel trim. They only tell you if the cats are working properly.
Baja
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 5,584
Likes: 7
From: Pittsburgh PA suburbs.
Savannah, Thanks for the meaning of AM and FM. What provids the inputs to the ECU for this determination? Is it the O2 Sensors? I am sure that is why mine has intermittently run rich for so long.
As far as Fortran, I flushed all that book learning from my memory cells with massive doses of Rum and Irish Whiskey over the years. Probably before lots of these fine younger Forum Members were even concieved. Some of them might even think FORTRAN was a mobile foot powered Fort and COBOL was a foreign port or something.
Remember the separate Card Punch and Card Readers we had at Southern Tech?
Speaking of our old Alma Mater, do they still hold the Annual Bathtub Races? That was the highlight of the school year, watching those bathtubs zoom around Campus Drive with those two-stroke dirt bike engines screaming. Nothing else like it~!
As far as Fortran, I flushed all that book learning from my memory cells with massive doses of Rum and Irish Whiskey over the years. Probably before lots of these fine younger Forum Members were even concieved. Some of them might even think FORTRAN was a mobile foot powered Fort and COBOL was a foreign port or something.
Remember the separate Card Punch and Card Readers we had at Southern Tech?
Speaking of our old Alma Mater, do they still hold the Annual Bathtub Races? That was the highlight of the school year, watching those bathtubs zoom around Campus Drive with those two-stroke dirt bike engines screaming. Nothing else like it~!
Super Moderator
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 16,322
Likes: 88
From: Savannah Georgia
I recall that more senior students had learned to keep three rubber bands on the damn pile of punch cards....
The ECU is looking at O2s, MAF, etc. Read all about it in the GEMS book. Here's a pix of a fuel map (not Rover). Basically think of it as a sheet of plywood floating on the water. Stand in the middle, things may be normal, move to any edge and something else is going to move up, or just hit a limit and tip over. So the ECU is trying to use all these inputs and calculations to keep fuel air mix at the stoichiometric ideal ratio of 14.7:1.
The ECU is looking at O2s, MAF, etc. Read all about it in the GEMS book. Here's a pix of a fuel map (not Rover). Basically think of it as a sheet of plywood floating on the water. Stand in the middle, things may be normal, move to any edge and something else is going to move up, or just hit a limit and tip over. So the ECU is trying to use all these inputs and calculations to keep fuel air mix at the stoichiometric ideal ratio of 14.7:1.
